Types of Bicycle Shoes/clipless/cleats how do they work?

[AussieJester]

I would like to know a lil about bicycle shoes/pedal combos, i.e how 'cliples/cleats' work, or more precisely, how you get them out once you clip them in AND is the "hold strength" of the pedal on the cleat adjustable, for example, could i make it very very easy to get the cleat out of the pedal? Seeing i am a incomplete paraplegic that is, i dont have any movement at all below my knees SO, with that knowledge onboard, would it be at all possible to get my foot out of the pedal using my upper leg strength only or would i need to lean down and pull my foot by hand to get it out of the pedal?

i'm in a catch 22, if my feet were clipped to the pedals i could pedal a bike no probs, not hugely fast but on a flat surface i could pedal about, without my feet clipped or tied to the pedals however, i can't turn the crank a resolution without one or both feet slipping off, i have as HiGHSiDE Hyena affectionately calls them, floppy feet LoL...

If someone could perhaps let me know the 'action' needed to remove ones foot i.e do you pull directly back, pull up left right etc ...

The only other option I would have is too physically strap my feet to the pedals using the good ol toe clip and strap scenario which just has me falling over as i struggle to get flip the latch and get my foot out which would likely get caught up etc

...So will these clip-less things work if they are adjustable for light pressure needed to release them bering in mind, i wont be applying great pressure on the pedals, just the simple rotating of the pedals under no load would give my legs a major workout...or is it going to be a case of pedals for show for me again?

Thanks in advance for any help in this matter fellas...


KiM

 

[rebelpilot]

I have only ever used the clips on my specialized bike. They require a strong twist of the foot to disengage (I push my heels out away from the bike) The tension is adjustable.
I think getting the pedals to clip on may be the most challenging part. I just tried to put the shoe on the pedal with my hand and I couldn't. They seem to require a strong down force to engage. My bike is sitting upside down on the floor without a rear wheel at the moment, and I put one shoe on my foot and tried to insert it, and I can't get it to latch on.

 

[HAL9000v2.0]

All shoes I saw had some kind of twisting action and most of them were heal out firs.
I think that for you the best will be some use something like complete-sole-like-pedals with heel rest and neodium magnet under your toes so you can take your foot simply by pulling your legs straight. Then you can use normal snickers with piece of metal in your sole. Roughly I will say magnet should be odo 30mm some 10 mm thick and sam dimension metal plate 2 mm thick should make some 40kg force. I think that will be enough to hold your foot in position and not strong enough so you can take it off.
I will make sketch later...

 

[docnjoj]

Hey AJ
I use clipless pedals (Shimano SPD) and you need to be able to rotate your lower leg. There are some models that allow you to pull forward and up to disengage. You gotta try them at the bike shop, but HAL seems to have a good idea (as usual). Some companies make foot sized (full length) pedals with straps. I would consult those guys in Britain who are making that new hub motor/battery pack. I have a senior moment and can't remember their name??????
Good luck with your effort!
otherDoc
The owners name is Mark, I believe.
edit: Team Hybrid! I may be slow but at least I'm unsure

 

[AussieJester]

Thanks to all who replied, i was dreading it would be a twisting action, i can't in anyway do that, my
motorskills as far as leg/foot accuracy goes aren't great either, so puting the things in would also be a struggle
as suggested by eebel pilot.... so clipless are out.

Hal...your idea isn't bad at all actually its damn good idea!, no need to sketch either buddy i follow the concept no probs well described thx... i reckon that might just work to you know, some grippy pedals and some magnets to pull the shoes sole down onto the teeth of the pedals... Ebay for Neodymium magnets here i come lil epoxy to the pedals bang on the magnets lump of steel in the sole of the shoes ans i'm set to pedal Officer...i should of thought of that myself LoL... Thankz Hal '-)

Thanks guys...

KiM

EDIT.... I reckon 2-3 of these embedded in the sole of the shoe and a steel plate on the pedal Hal!! back to front from your way but still same principle
and heres the perfect pedal to pop a rectangular steel plat in the center of!

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=17780

Should pull the rubbery sole of my joggers onto those big beefy spikes on the pedal to help stop slipping as i pedal along doing a frighteningly realistic imitation of Lance Armstong

 

[Ypedal]

I was gonna suggest snowboard latches, but damn.. magnets are a way better idea !! ( clean look to the bike without the big flappy straps.. )

 

[Rassy]

AJ, When I started riding more a few years ago, my brother was always going on about the need for clipless. My brother and his buds all used clipless on their recumbent two wheel bikes. So I finally got a pair, but I put them on my delta trike for starters. Got pretty good with them, but I was too CS to put them on the recumbent bike. The word with clipless seems to be its not if you fall, but when you fall. Anyway, with your actuators that may not be a problem.

As far as adjusting the pressure required to clip in and out, yes, they are very adjustable. After his stroke, I put clipless on my brother's trike, but he couldn't keep his foot from twisting and dropping out. However, he is now using the clipless without any problem.

So here's what I really responded for. Get a set of clipless and put them on your trike for a while. Get used to them, make sure they work good for you while on a stable platform, and then decide where to go with them.

And just for the record, I wouldn't want to ride my tadpole trike without clipless pedals.

 

[montyp]

I know this is not really on topic, but I would suggest using toe straps that are not tighted. Something like power grips - http://www.triathletesports.com/Power-Grips-Standard-295mm-with-Hardware-Black-p/000019936444-shop2b2.htm?gdftrk=gdfV21962_a_7c337_a_7c868_a_7c000019936444_d_Shop2b2

Although - an electromagnet would to awesome - now to find a power source

 

[Jeremy Harris]

Kim,

I don't know if this helps or not, but I've just been out to my pile of "may come in handy" parts and found a couple of rudder pedals from an old Eipper Quicksilver microlight (actually they're Scrapheap relics, from the microlight used in the Airboats programme). I've taken a couple of snaps of them, as they might do for "whole foot" pedals:





They're yours if they're any good to you and you want them.

Jeremy

 

[oldpiper]

Just a thought, if you decide to make a magnet-based pedal-"clamp", you might want to rig up a retracting mechanism like you see on those magnet nail-collectors (sweep the magnet across the floor to pick up the nails, then when it's over the bucket, pull the magnet back from the nails [retained on a thin Al sheet] and the nails fall, like this one

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_16284_16284). With something like this in your pedal activated by a cable(?), you could use a lot stronger magnet to hold your cleats in place for riding but still be able to leave the bike easily.

Cameron

 

[LI-ghtcycle]

Sounds like you have a good idea there with the magnents! Hope it works out for ya, but I wanted to add as far as clip-less Shimano SPD pedals, not only do you need some ability to move your foot around getting in and out of the clips, but a great deal of the pedaling requires a certain amount of strength in your ankle, so I'm wondering if that might be a problem for you as well?

I'm curious if your looking to give your legs a work-out or just meet more of a legal definition of a "E-Bike" by pedaling? :wink:

Let us know how it works out! Maybe you can start a line of magnetic pedals and sell them! 8)

 

[liveforphysics]

Steel plate on the shoe that hangs down 1cm.
A pocket that has the female side to recieve the shoe plate.
A pair of 20lbs pull magnets flushed into the floor of the pedal recess.

 

[SoSauty]

AJ,

IMO the only way to go for e-bikers is the Shimano multi-directional cleats. They are available most everywhere for less than $20 and Shimano is the most common clipless pedal around. Adjust the spring setting in your pedal for a weak setting and you'll pull/break your shoe loose without thinking as you prepare to stop. When pedling you'll still be able to pull/exert considerable energy upward, kinda on the back stroke, which is energy efficient as well as great exercise for aging knees. Standard cleats adjusted moderate to firm, for veteran bikers not experienced to clipling in, is a broken clavicle (collar bone) waiting to happen.

http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/PE406Z13-Shimano+Sm-Sh56+Multi+Release+Spd+Cleat.aspx

 

[AussieJester]

I know this is not really on topic, but I would suggest using toe straps that are not tighted. Something like power grips - http://www.triathletesports.com/Power-Grips-Standard-295mm-with-Hardware-Black-p/000019936444-shop2b2.htm?gdftrk=gdfV21962_a_7c337_a_7c868_a_7c000019936444_d_Shop2b2

Although - an electromagnet would to awesome - now to find a power source

I have actually seen these on Chain Reaction (or similar anywaz) and thought they would work also, if the magnets fail it will be my next purchase for sure.

@ Mr Jeremy:- i want to steer away from full foot pedals and attempt to make standard bicycle pedals work, its a looks thing Jermey you know im a bling wanker have to have some classy looking pedals hehehe..

@Rassy:- your a year behind buddy, i don't even have a trike anymore mate i gave it away to another paraplegic, Endless Sphere local memeber nick "HBWC" (Jono) you might see it (trike) rebuilt again someday?! i hear he got his 20x4.25in rims yesterday, i gave him the trike hubs and a set of spokes to suit those rims, he has everything except a springer tube for the springer forks, if he makes one for those the trike could be reassembled as it was when i had it, with a cyclone 1500watt motor instead of the 1000watt Unite i had in it which would be a nice improvement....Hopefully Jono gets past the talking about it stage and actually gets to the doing it stage, i'm doubtful atm but.... never know, would be nice to see the old girl up and running again

So magnets will be what i try for sure, its simple, neat and i think it will work...I want to be able to keep my feet firmly on the pedals at all times, even a bump in the roa knocks them off now, plus i would like to be able to pedal, i wont/don't expect to put any actual input resulting in forward motion into the pedals, but just the turning over unloaded will exercise my weak legs and possibly help reduce the painful spasms, thats the main objective, weight loss second.

Thanks to all that have offered suggestions/input much appreciated, shall be ordering magnets and the pedals i linked to first light tomorrow (pay day 750 dollar order with Chain Reaction pending be like Christmas when that one lands)

KiM

 

[curious]

You can try BMX platform pedals that have anti-slip pins with trail shoes that have relatively stiff and well-threaded sole. I have these pedals both on my ebike and recumbent (soon to be electric) and it is pretty much impossible to slip off the pedal even on a bent where the pedal surface can be vertical. The pins stick in my shoe thread to such degree that you really have to raise the foot from the pedal if you want to change foot position a bit. They are also quite sturdy.
Try them, you can usually get a cheap Wellgo V8 knock-off just to test the idea.
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=563
You may need to experiment with different shoes, finding the sole that mates well with the pedal pin arrangement. Take the pedal to the local sport shoe store and see what you get.

I did use SPD when I was active MTB'er, mostly because it made hopping over small obstacles a trivial thing. Right now BMX pinned platforms is all I need.
I do not think searching for proper clip-in position and twisting foot to clip-out will be comfortable/doable for you.

 

[Toorbough ULL-Zeveigh]

velcro

 

[tom2slow]

There are a bunch of different styles of clipless to be tried.

I would recommend going to a BIG LBS and talking to them. I have a friend that rolled off a speeding toboggan and did a huge amount of damage to his right leg. He has extremely limited ability to rotate his leg. He has found that a set of Egg Beaters work really well for him however.
I find that SPD's are very easy to locate w/ my feet. My kid like the Look style for his racing stuff. I agree with Rassy, absolutely mandatory with a tadpole. Picture the toe drag, knee under the seat, trikes fips on your head kinda thing

There are also all kinda of toe clips available, I commuted on an upright Trek for a long time w/ just toe clips.

You can also hang out at bikeforums.net Like here they all like to help, tons of NON electric experience

YMMV.

 

[grindz145]

I love egg beaters, especially for the mud/dirt.

 

[sk8norcal]

assuming you use those outriggers when you come to a stop...

old school top clips plus cleats might work bettler than clipless,


speaking of magnet shoes,
they got these for skateboarding,

http://wackyboards.blogspot.com/2009/07/4size-magnet-shoeboard.html
http://wackyboards.blogspot.com/2009/07/magnatron.html

and velcro back in the 70's
http://wackyboards.blogspot.com/2009/07/suspenders-velcro-binding.html

 

[docnjoj]

I missed Rassy's post about the requirement of some type of clip or lock for the pedals of a tadpole trike. Probably snap the leg in two if it went under the trike. Absolutely necessary in my opinion. I used Powerstraps for years but SPD clipless are much better. Sorry AJ for the OT post but this is critical imformation. Clips might be the simple answer but the magnets and velcro also seem like fine ideas to test.
otherDoc

 

[Tiberius]

Kim,

How about not using the high technology for the grip itself, but just for the eject mechanism?

What I mean is not using magnets as the direct holding mechanism, but taking one of the clipless systems and having an electromagnetic release mechanism.

Maybe you could have a solenoid on the pedal that opened the mechanism. But that might pose wiring problems. Or you could have something on a boot that rotated the spigot to release it from the pedal.

Nick

 

[tom2slow]

It dawned on me today....

For everyones consideration:

Its easy(ier) to slide a magnet off a steel plate. That might impact the plan to use magnets. And Velcro is a dirt magnet (no pun)

--T

 

[AussieJester]

It dawned on me today....

For everyones consideration:

Its easy(ier) to slide a magnet off a steel plate. That might impact the plan to use magnets. And Velcro is a dirt magnet (no pun)

--T

The idea as i perseive it, is to pull the shoe down onto the pedals

^^^ These are the pedals i have purchased

20mm x ~50mmx 2mm length of steel fastened to the middle of the pedal, then 3-4? circularrare earth magnets
on the sole of the shoe, idea being pull the shoe's sole into those big juicy spikes on the cage of the pedals...
Easy one to trial i have plenty of shoes i would be happy to melt/epoxy magnets too for the trials good ol Duct Tape!@?!?##@<--"could"
be used, would have to be digital camo though :lol: to temorarily hold the strip of steal to the body part of the pedal
if the concept works as well as expected then we can get fancy with shaped steel plate to permantly mount to the pedals
This is such a simple solution, it should even be possible to 'tune' the setup to suit my leg strength to get the best
balance between holding/releasing the foot from the setup/pedal just by altering magnet numbers and their placement.. :wink:

Shall see how it goes, i'm optimisic this is the best solution KISS is often best...

KiM

 

[Ypedal]

I think the magnets would be best on the pedals and metal on the shoes.. thos way you don't pick up a pile of crap on the shoes when off the bike.. having your feet awkwardly stick to the sides of your chair might get weird loll..

 

[tom2slow]

agree the magnet on the pedal would be more elegant.

I have spent some time in clip ins and its important to remember that 'float' is very important to knee and ankle health. You can not fix the shoe to the pedal with no movement. There has to be a couple degree's of rotation (picture heels in and out pivoting on the balls of the feet). More than the preset float releases the cleat. When you design the shoe bottom make sure to include small relief areas to allow the spikes to slide in.

--T