"Zephyr" - Finally, the "v4" Fechter/Goodrum/Hecker BMS...

[fechter]

Gary was going to get a new picture for the instructions. We've posted about it quite a bit in this thread, but I guess Gary's been too busy to get it changed yet. Sorry for the confusion. When in doubt, go by the schematic. On the pot, I can check on that. There should be an alternate that fits in the holes. If not, the procedure has been to bend the legs on the pot to fit the holes.

The two pin header locations should all be labeled. If you don't see a marking, shoot a picture of it and post it. They are all optional depending on how you want to use the board. For 'normal' operation with the throttle pull down and everything on one board, none of them are required. The EOC Disable one is handy for testing, so should generally be installed, but is not used in actual operation.

 

[Zenid]

When in doubt, go by the schematic.

Many of us less experienced hobbyists can't easily decipher the schematics and transpose them onto the board. That's why the boards are marked, and many of us - unfortunately - do have to place our trust in them being correctly labelled. Perhaps a small revisions list could be included on this thread's 'front-post' showing what errors have been found and listing corrections to the official documentation or board markings...

But, yes, as I go along I will be sure to post pictures if I'm unsure about what to put where, and which way round.

 

[GGoodrum]

Sorry about the confusion but I had been waiting on Andy to take new pictures, as I don't have a new one of these built up yet. Andy's been tied up lately with computer problems, and hasn't been able to take new pictures. If somebody else has a picture, by all means, please send it to me, via PM, and I'll update the instructions, again. FWIW, the latest boards I just received now have standard square holes for the positive side of the cap, which connects to the base of the shunt transistor.

-- Gary

 

[Zenid]

Thanks for the update, Gary.

I have a query about the three MOSFETs at the top left of the board. Going through my Mouser parts, I seem to be missing one. I have onr each of the following:

512-FQP6N40C
400V N-Ch Q-FET

512-FDP036N10A
PTS CH 100V 3.6MOhm

These correspond to
Q1: FQP2N60C N-Channel FET
Q3: FDP036N10A N-Channel FET

in the parts list. However it looks to me that there are TWO "Q3" FETs on the board, with the board being labelled Q3 in two places next to each one. Are there therefore supposed to be 2 X FDP036N10A, and not just the one as specified?
What is the third?

 

[The Mighty Volt]

Hi, I don't want to hijack the thread, I was wondering if somebody could direct me to a link for the components BOM for the original/previous Fechter-Goodrum BMS. Thanks.

 

[Gregb]

Thanks for the update, Gary.

I have a query about the three MOSFETs at the top left of the board. Going through my Mouser parts, I seem to be missing one. I have onr each of the following:

512-FQP6N40C
400V N-Ch Q-FET

512-FDP036N10A
PTS CH 100V 3.6MOhm

These correspond to
Q1: FQP2N60C N-Channel FET
Q3: FDP036N10A N-Channel FET

in the parts list. However it looks to me that there are TWO "Q3" FETs on the board, with the board being labelled Q3 in two places next to each one. Are there therefore supposed to be 2 X FDP036N10A, and not just the one as specified?
What is the third?

there is a previous posting on this. second/parallel one is only needed for high current applications.

 

[Gregb]

.[/b] On the pot, I can check on that. There should be an alternate that fits in the holes. If not, the procedure has been to bend the legs on the pot to fit the holes.

wasn't able to do that legs were too wide. but have put standoffs in. looks a bit rough but works.

The EOC Disable one is handy for testing, so should generally be installed, but is not used in actual operation.

Thanks, was beginning to suspect that.

 

[chxs]

I have problems with my BMS V 4.4 ... when i connect my BMS to pack the red light come on ! and if i play with the pots it turn off ... when i have connected the charger the light change to orange ... but the fets getting very hot ... i have try to turn the pots and the irfb4110 have explosed !! Can u help me ... i dont know where to look

Tanks

 

[Gregb]

I am not sure I understand your cell cct tests. are you testing with the multimeter across the 5.1V zener?? or across each wire to to the pos rail?? If you put a MM across the first you get a slow charge of the 47uF capacitor..through r103 and r104....
Page 9 says ...9 wires that need to go to each group of 9 cells.... that should be 8 cells.If only using 8 cells then I assume wire 9 goes to the + rail???

 

[fechter]

I have problems with my BMS V 4.4 ... when i connect my BMS to pack the red light come on ! and if i play with the pots it turn off ... when i have connected the charger the light change to orange ... but the fets getting very hot ... i have try to turn the pots and the irfb4110 have explosed !! Can u help me ... i dont know where to look

Tanks

Yikes! how many amps are you running?

There are a bunch of tests in the instructions. It's best to test initially with no cells attached and a variable power supply. If no variable supply, use a light bulb or resistor in series with the charger to limit the current.

Keep in mind that due to the low power consumption parts, many areas of the board are going to be sensitive to soldering flux residue. Clean the board well. Double check that all the parts were installed correctly (but don't rely on the pictures yet!).

 

[chxs]

I have problems with my BMS V 4.4 ... when i connect my BMS to pack the red light come on ! and if i play with the pots it turn off ... when i have connected the charger the light change to orange ... but the fets getting very hot ... i have try to turn the pots and the irfb4110 have explosed !! Can u help me ... i dont know where to look

Tanks

Yikes! how many amps are you running?

There are a bunch of tests in the instructions. It's best to test initially with no cells attached and a variable power supply. If no variable supply, use a light bulb or resistor in series with the charger to limit the current.

Keep in mind that due to the low power consumption parts, many areas of the board are going to be sensitive to soldering flux residue. Clean the board well. Double check that all the parts were installed correctly (but don't rely on the pictures yet!).

I run 28S of lifepo4 at 11.3 amps ... its not that hard ... but why when i connect the PACK connector the charge light come on and red ??

 

[Nate]

I was wondering if somebody could direct me to a link for the components BOM for the original/previous Fechter-Goodrum BMS. Thanks.

Here is the thread: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5416 Not sure where the BOM is as there are several versions...

Sorry about the confusion but I had been waiting on Andy to take new pictures...

Gary - I'll send you some pictures of my 4.4
- Nate

 

[Zenid]

I've found an issue with my parts: For Q1, "FQP2N60C N-Channel FET" is the part listed in the documentation, but the code which appears seems to be for FQP2N40C, and that's what I've been sent. Will this work, or do I need the actual FQP2N60C N-Channel FET?

Page 2, Line 12
Q1: FQP2N60C N-Channel FET 512-FQP2N60C 512-FQP6N40C 1 512-FQP6N40C|1

Also I don't see anything in the instructions about installing the amber LEDS. Which way round do these go? I notice one leg is slightly longer than the other, does this go in the right hole or the left?

[EDIT] I see now from the diagram that the positive goes towards its neigbouring transistor. Does this mean that the long leg goes in the RIGHT hole?

[EDIT2] I found this bit, now: "The shorter leg of the LED is the cathode, and goes in the hole with the square pad."

 

[fechter]

I've found an issue with my parts: For Q1, "FQP2N60C N-Channel FET" is the part listed in the documentation, but the code which appears seems to be for FQP2N40C, and that's what I've been sent. Will this work, or do I need the actual FQP2N60C N-Channel FET?

Page 2, Line 12
Q1: FQP2N60C N-Channel FET 512-FQP2N60C 512-FQP6N40C 1 512-FQP6N40C|1

Either one will work. The FQP6N40C is probably better.

 

[Zenid]

Some pictures of my build so far:

http://zenid10.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/gfb-st2-16.jpg
http://zenid10.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/gfb-st3-16.jpg
http://zenid10.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/gfb-st4-16.jpg

The locknuts that go with the M3 buttonhead screws look like they have plastic threads in them in the pictures in the assembly guide. Is there any reason why solid metal screws and locknuts can't be used instead?

 

[fechter]

Thanks for posting the pics.

The screws can be all metal. The lock nuts are the nylon insert type. You just don't want the screws coming loose and bounce around in the box. I build them without screws at all. As long as the transistors are clamped against the board when you solder them, they stay flat and the heat transfer will be adequate. RTV silicone glue is another option. Glue the transistors in place, wait for the glue to cure, then solder the legs.

 

[Gregb]

Some pictures of my build so far:
[
http://zenid10.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/gfb-st4-16.jpg

?

zenid are your BD 136s mounted the right way???? Page 6. "for the top mounted BD136s the nomenclature goes face down"
The bd 136 pins are, from the left, E, C, B with the legs down print side toward you. Yhe board holes are B,C,E from the top of the board. The collectors on mine are all exposed as is normal for better heat transference.

 

[Zenid]

Some pictures of my build so far:
http://zenid10.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/gfb-st4-16.jpg
?

zenid are your BD 136s mounted the right way???? Page 6. "for the top mounted BD136s the nomenclature goes face down"

The BD136s are top-mounted, and the nomenclature (the wording on the chip) is face-down.

Isn't that clear from the photo, where the writing on the chips is not on the top-side (just like in the picture on the instruction guide)? :?

 

[Gregb]

No sorry. to me the photo doesn't show the bare back, it looks solid black. You can't read the printing on mine without angling it under a bright light so that is why I asked. Obviously different manufacturers...Just thought I would ask before you turn it on...better to be sure than sorry...
My capacitors are also different to yours...

 

[Zenid]

No sorry. to me the photo doesn't show the bare back, it looks solid black. You can't read the printing on mine without angling it under a bright light so that is why I asked. Obviously different manufacturers...Just thought I would ask before you turn it on...better to be sure than sorry...
My capacitors are also different to yours...

Thanks. The printing is easy to make out on mine, especially since I've used lighting to make any reflective markings 'shine'. Thanks for your concern
Yes, I used a replacement cap type suggested earlier in the thread.
P.S: The picture just shows the left two 'banks'. Mine's a 24 cell version and has one more bank off-shot to the right.

 

[GGoodrum]

I've added new pics, and have updated the instructions, and the links on the first post. Thanks to Xenid and Nate for sending pics.

-- Gary

 

[geoff57]

I've added new pics, and have updated the instructions, and the links on the first post. Thanks to Xenid and Nate for sending pics.

-- Gary

Hi
Gary if the schematics have changed from the version that you sent out in the manual when we bought the zephyrs can you send out replacements, I bought 2 one for me and one for zenid so we both need copy's, if there are no changes let us knows well.

Geoff

 

[GGoodrum]

I've added new pics, and have updated the instructions, and the links on the first post. Thanks to Xenid and Nate for sending pics.

-- Gary

Hi
Gary if the schematics have changed from the version that you sent out in the manual when we bought the zephyrs can you send out replacements, I bought 2 one for me and one for zenid so we both need copy's, if there are no changes let us knows well.

Geoff

The schematics haven't changed.

-- Gary

 

[Gregb]

what if one doesn't have access to a bench power supply? There was no mention of this requirement when I bought mine until I read the instructions.

 

[Zenid]

No project would be complete (or incomplete) without having at least a couple of mysterious bits left over that don't seem to go anywhere.

I am left with:
TVS: Transient voltage suppressor 1.5kW (576-1.5KE82A)
2-pin header (538-22-03-2021)

Any idea where these go? :?