vanilla ice
1 MW
317537 said:
Actually the camera crew will ask your permission to use the footage after the filming is done. Don't ask me how I know..
7 Police Cars to Detain Man on Electric Bike
- Thread starter Scorefield
- Start date
Actually the camera crew will ask your permission to use the footage after the filming is done. Don't ask me how I know..
Lessss
1 MW
What do cops do? They deal with the filth of our society, day and night, over and over. They eventually come to see everybody in that light. It's important to be polite to distinguish yourself from that filth. If a cop has an attitude it's even more important to be polite cause if he has an attitude he may just be a rotten cop and just waiting for an excuse to be a bully. If you have to pull out a camera, point it at yourself not the cop.
Also remember that a lot of cops are former military. The us military is irresponsibly handing out amphetamines without proper doctor control and follow-up as anti-fatigue meds. Translation a lot of discharged military are hooked on speed. A very bad combination - speed freak cops.
Also remember that a lot of cops are former military. The us military is irresponsibly handing out amphetamines without proper doctor control and follow-up as anti-fatigue meds. Translation a lot of discharged military are hooked on speed. A very bad combination - speed freak cops.
liveforphysics
100 TW
nicobie said:
The point I was trying to make, is these should not be confused with how bad/crooked cops behave.
Cops are just people. Like with anything else, some are good, some are bad. Those were simply confused good cops getting made fun of on camera.
nicobie said:
Read some Thomas Jefferson quotes. 100% as true today as they were 200year ago. If you like what you read, join me as a libertarian.
http://quotes.liberty-tree.ca/quotes_by/thomas+jefferson
Well, I have to update my post above. Tonite heading home from helping a friend and then the grocery store (after a number of delays along the way to the store due to some motor mount problems--this thing has too much torque for it's own good!), on 35th Ave on the only stretch of major road I had to be on, and for less than half a mile, a big Phoenix Police SUV pulls alongside and didn't actually pull me over or anything, but I stopped so I could hear the officer.
He suggested that I ride on the sidewalk; didn't actually order me to but said that I "might want to consider" it in a way that sounded like I might have trouble if I didn't do it. I replied that I thought I was riding per the rules of the road, and he just said "there's a lot of drunks out" and something else I can't fully remember about being safer, I think. Perhaps he really was trying to be helpful, but I didn't like being essentially told to get off the road by someone that ought to know better.
Anyway, I pulled up onto the sidewalk at the next corner and rode on that from there for a mile and a half (since there's no point in riding on the canal path to avoid traffic if I'm supposed to ride on the sidewalk instead of the road). Unlike the road where I was not in anyone's way or endangering anyone, I had a number of people trying to pull out of driveways or into them, turning into or from intersections, etc, all quite surprised by my motorcycle-looking bike (with the really bright CFL headlight and tailight, plus turn signals, mirror, etc) being on the sidewalk, of course. I rode at only 10MPH instead of 20, as that would be stupid on a sidewalk. I exited the sidewalk and went back on the road twice for pedestrians I saw coming up, but there were more than a few people just chatting far enough off the sidewalk on lawns, etc, to not worry about who were startled by me coming by.
Once I was near enough home I just got back on the road, signalled to change lanes across the road to the left turn lane, waited my turn, and went home from there normally.
But it bugged me all the way home that after all this time, and after I'd posted before that I'd been apparently considered part of traffic by at least the police, that now one of them (that I'm sure I've seen around in the area before, and I'm sure has seen me) doesn't apparently think I belong on the road.
Still bugs me now.
He suggested that I ride on the sidewalk; didn't actually order me to but said that I "might want to consider" it in a way that sounded like I might have trouble if I didn't do it. I replied that I thought I was riding per the rules of the road, and he just said "there's a lot of drunks out" and something else I can't fully remember about being safer, I think. Perhaps he really was trying to be helpful, but I didn't like being essentially told to get off the road by someone that ought to know better.
Anyway, I pulled up onto the sidewalk at the next corner and rode on that from there for a mile and a half (since there's no point in riding on the canal path to avoid traffic if I'm supposed to ride on the sidewalk instead of the road). Unlike the road where I was not in anyone's way or endangering anyone, I had a number of people trying to pull out of driveways or into them, turning into or from intersections, etc, all quite surprised by my motorcycle-looking bike (with the really bright CFL headlight and tailight, plus turn signals, mirror, etc) being on the sidewalk, of course. I rode at only 10MPH instead of 20, as that would be stupid on a sidewalk. I exited the sidewalk and went back on the road twice for pedestrians I saw coming up, but there were more than a few people just chatting far enough off the sidewalk on lawns, etc, to not worry about who were startled by me coming by.
Once I was near enough home I just got back on the road, signalled to change lanes across the road to the left turn lane, waited my turn, and went home from there normally.
But it bugged me all the way home that after all this time, and after I'd posted before that I'd been apparently considered part of traffic by at least the police, that now one of them (that I'm sure I've seen around in the area before, and I'm sure has seen me) doesn't apparently think I belong on the road.
Still bugs me now.
Lessss
1 MW
Send a letter to your local police department and make a point, describe what you did just here but then end the letter with, "If I were diving a small compact car would you have advised me to drive it on the sidewalk because there were a lot of drunks out?"
Then point out he actually put you and the walking public in more danger with his advice.
Then point out he actually put you and the walking public in more danger with his advice.
I lived in the Phoenix valley for 20 years and purposely avoided being on the road on Friday and Saturday nights.
amberwolf, what was the speed difference where the cop gave advice? I'm guessing it was one of the 45 MPH roads where everyone goes 50.
amberwolf, what was the speed difference where the cop gave advice? I'm guessing it was one of the 45 MPH roads where everyone goes 50.
nicobie
100 MW
liveforphysics said:
Hahahahahahaa.....
The signature line under all my emails reads,
Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. – P.J. O'Rourke
I think it's a stretch of 40mph road; there's a park and stuff right there; generally people do stay within the limits on that part, at least. Plus this was really late at night, with not much traffic at all, on a Thurs night. What traffic there was had no problem passing me in the other southbound lane, and I was as far over to the right as I could get without running aground on the curb or hitting the many deep potholes and high lumps at the corners.
Either way, I still don't see why someone that ought to know better would tell anyone to ride on the sidewalks (especially with the huge bike I have--it's wide enough to not be able to pass anyone else that's on the sidewalk, or even go around the numerous signs and utility poles that are embedded in the middle of the sidewalk in various places).
Ah, well, it doesn't matter. I got home ok without anyone hurting me or me hurting anyone else, and hopefully it isn't going to happen again soon. If it does, I'll see if I can at least get the police vehicle number and plate, so if anything comes of it (like another officer later telling me to get *off* the sidewalk) I can advise them of it, and also pass it on to the central offices so the re-education of personnel can be done (if they care).
Either way, I still don't see why someone that ought to know better would tell anyone to ride on the sidewalks (especially with the huge bike I have--it's wide enough to not be able to pass anyone else that's on the sidewalk, or even go around the numerous signs and utility poles that are embedded in the middle of the sidewalk in various places).
Ah, well, it doesn't matter. I got home ok without anyone hurting me or me hurting anyone else, and hopefully it isn't going to happen again soon. If it does, I'll see if I can at least get the police vehicle number and plate, so if anything comes of it (like another officer later telling me to get *off* the sidewalk) I can advise them of it, and also pass it on to the central offices so the re-education of personnel can be done (if they care).
deardancer3 said:
yep, I wonder if they recognized him. Cops do keep tabs on people. There's more on your file than people realize these days. I think cops are even able to make notes on people who they stop for other cops. The guy was being a jerk to the cop, though. I always try to be polite to the police and they never really stick it to me. I've only had one ticket in the last 9 years. I've actually only been stopped two or three times over the last 9 years too.
def215
10 kW
im not sure if this is a repost but ill post it anyway. saw this video on youtube about a guy who got fined for riding his e-bike.
[youtube]-czwy6UPvRs[/youtube]
[youtube]XxDopnyNgcs[/youtube]
i thought it was interesting that this happened and in all places phoenix. what is your take on this people of e-s? makes me question my e-bike build that is in progress now that will be used as my transportation because of the fear of ignorant police like this.
[youtube]-czwy6UPvRs[/youtube]
[youtube]XxDopnyNgcs[/youtube]
i thought it was interesting that this happened and in all places phoenix. what is your take on this people of e-s? makes me question my e-bike build that is in progress now that will be used as my transportation because of the fear of ignorant police like this.
Jonathan in Hiram
1 kW
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2009
- Messages
- 446
Maricopa county, the county in which Phoenix is located, is sometimes known as "Marikafka" county, after the author Franz Kafka.
Sheriff Joe Arpaio and his department is well known to be more or less out of control, it's unsurprising to me that this sort of thing would happen in Phoenix.
This is far from the only outrageous thing that has happened with respect to Marikafka county law enforcement.
http://www.balloon-juice.com/?p=30293#comments
And..
http://www.balloon-juice.com/?p=30128#comments
These are just off the top of my head, stuff I remember in the last week or so.
BTW and FWIW, Balloon-Juice.com is possibly the smartest, funniest and snarkiest political blog on da tubez..
Sheriff Joe Arpaio and his department is well known to be more or less out of control, it's unsurprising to me that this sort of thing would happen in Phoenix.
This is far from the only outrageous thing that has happened with respect to Marikafka county law enforcement.
http://www.balloon-juice.com/?p=30293#comments
And..
http://www.balloon-juice.com/?p=30128#comments
These are just off the top of my head, stuff I remember in the last week or so.
BTW and FWIW, Balloon-Juice.com is possibly the smartest, funniest and snarkiest political blog on da tubez..
dogman dan
1 PW
1. An excellent example of what I like to call flunking the attitude test. The proper responses to police are "yes sir, no sir, I don't know sir" in most cases. When you flunk the attitude test, all the cops gather to watch the fun, now it's impossible for the original cop to back down from what he started.
2. Why would you want to flunk the attitude test in a city where a conviction can land you on a chain gang living in a tent wearing pink underwear when it's 120F outside?
3. Cops tend to ignore you on a bike unless you are riding stupid. This is the beginning of flunking the attitude test. Stop at stop signs, don't ride on the wrong side of the street, etc. Don't look so goofy they think you must be drunk.
4. Shut up, take your tickets, and then go argue in court to the judge, who possibly does know the law. In court bring your copy of arizona statute 28-2516 , which includes the Arizona definition of an electric bike along with pictures of the bike showing the pedals, and swear on the bible it can't go faster than 20 mph.
5. Get rid of the "looks too damn much like a moped" ebike.
6. If you have a 72v 35 amp controller on your motor, yer screwed if you talk to a cop, so really don't flunk the attitude test out there.
7. Remember you are in Arizona, what's the fine for 5 mph over the speed limit there, $500? Or is it more. I haul ass all over New Mexico but in Arizona I drive like I'm taking my licence test.
Here in NM where I live, I'm a moped, so I do carry my drivers licence and wear a helmet. Don't need a plate here, but I can legaly go 25 mph.
2. Why would you want to flunk the attitude test in a city where a conviction can land you on a chain gang living in a tent wearing pink underwear when it's 120F outside?
3. Cops tend to ignore you on a bike unless you are riding stupid. This is the beginning of flunking the attitude test. Stop at stop signs, don't ride on the wrong side of the street, etc. Don't look so goofy they think you must be drunk.
4. Shut up, take your tickets, and then go argue in court to the judge, who possibly does know the law. In court bring your copy of arizona statute 28-2516 , which includes the Arizona definition of an electric bike along with pictures of the bike showing the pedals, and swear on the bible it can't go faster than 20 mph.
5. Get rid of the "looks too damn much like a moped" ebike.
6. If you have a 72v 35 amp controller on your motor, yer screwed if you talk to a cop, so really don't flunk the attitude test out there.
7. Remember you are in Arizona, what's the fine for 5 mph over the speed limit there, $500? Or is it more. I haul ass all over New Mexico but in Arizona I drive like I'm taking my licence test.
Here in NM where I live, I'm a moped, so I do carry my drivers licence and wear a helmet. Don't need a plate here, but I can legaly go 25 mph.
diver
1 kW
the guy did nothing wrong imo. why are we supposed to be afraid to ask a cop a question. I cant believe how much money was spent at the tax payers expense over this.
deardancer3
10 kW
my opinion:
FRom my understanding of the other thread addressing this event, the guy was not riding a legitimate ebike as it had no pedals.
He also made it a hobby of taking on several other local issues, ie, he is a publicity hound.
Soo when a publicty hound rides an illegal vehicle, pulls out a camera on a boring Sunday morning, makes a really big deal out of it and is actually very wrong... then what do you think happens?
A cop can ask anyone their name and basic info for hardly any reason. Especially when you are driving a vehicle that looks illegal, and IS. If you have done nothing wrong, are straight and sober, and act normal, its really hard for a policeman to legally keep you from going about your business. In most places in most situations.
But when you are trying to create a commotion, pull out a camera, act like you know the law when you dont.... that does not equate to the normal routine of riding a legal ebike and behaving like a normal person.
I am sorry that he did this on an electric vehicle, almost an ebike. It can be really easy to skate by if you want to be under the radar. Very very easy. But if you want attention, then you better know what you are doing.
my two watts worth
edit for other Es thread:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=14237
d
FRom my understanding of the other thread addressing this event, the guy was not riding a legitimate ebike as it had no pedals.
He also made it a hobby of taking on several other local issues, ie, he is a publicity hound.
Soo when a publicty hound rides an illegal vehicle, pulls out a camera on a boring Sunday morning, makes a really big deal out of it and is actually very wrong... then what do you think happens?
A cop can ask anyone their name and basic info for hardly any reason. Especially when you are driving a vehicle that looks illegal, and IS. If you have done nothing wrong, are straight and sober, and act normal, its really hard for a policeman to legally keep you from going about your business. In most places in most situations.
But when you are trying to create a commotion, pull out a camera, act like you know the law when you dont.... that does not equate to the normal routine of riding a legal ebike and behaving like a normal person.
I am sorry that he did this on an electric vehicle, almost an ebike. It can be really easy to skate by if you want to be under the radar. Very very easy. But if you want attention, then you better know what you are doing.
my two watts worth
edit for other Es thread:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=14237
d
nicobie
100 MW
Not sure it had a chain, but it did have pedels.
diver
1 kW
aw now i understand . I thought it was a legal bike and they were hassling him.
thanks
thanks
diver
1 kW
i thought it had pedals..lol did he end up having to pay the tickets
dogman dan
1 PW
Only if he flunked the attitude test in court :lol: :lol: :lol:
He is riding a legal ebike, with pedals. But the ebikes that look exactly like a moped are asking for it, in my opinion. He should simply present the cop with a copy of the applicable state statute when stopped. Better yet, ditch the piece of crap and ride a bike that looks like a bike, and scoot along under the radar. It may be the cops know him well.
My brother in law once got a DUI. Grounds for stopping him was his face driving a car. The cops were dead on with that one, he'd been seen weaving around on his bicycle all drunk around town for a year since the first DUI got his licence took, and he often got kicked off the bus for being too drunk. Cops totally knew him, and seeing him driving was all they needed. He'd stolen moms car to go get more whiskey.
Back in the day, allways holding some marajuana, we old hippies learned real good not to flunk the attitude test. A freind of mine, another old hippe, forgot the training last year and got testy with a county sherrif. He tazed the frock out of her, to this day her arm doesn't quite work the same. Her husband, watching this happen, had his cop tear up his shoulder ligaments cuffing him when he got mad. Both his arms don't work right anymore. The whole thing was started by an asshole neighbor who likes to call in bogus complaints about monthly. The whole beef was bogus, but flunking the attitude test got them both charged with resisting a police officer. The tazing was so bogus it all got tossed out of court immediately so the lawyer only cost em $1,500.
Dont' flunk the attitude test.
Waddaya think, you live in a country were cops follow the rules? Ask Rodney King about that.
My brother got sarcastic at a border patrol checkpoint once. Three hours later, after reinstalling his seats in his car, he was on his way.
Don't flunk the attitude test.
Later on, after you get out of either jail or the hospital, the cop isn't even going to apologise. But you will get to pay the med bills, lawyer bills etc.
Don't flunk the attitued test.
He is riding a legal ebike, with pedals. But the ebikes that look exactly like a moped are asking for it, in my opinion. He should simply present the cop with a copy of the applicable state statute when stopped. Better yet, ditch the piece of crap and ride a bike that looks like a bike, and scoot along under the radar. It may be the cops know him well.
My brother in law once got a DUI. Grounds for stopping him was his face driving a car. The cops were dead on with that one, he'd been seen weaving around on his bicycle all drunk around town for a year since the first DUI got his licence took, and he often got kicked off the bus for being too drunk. Cops totally knew him, and seeing him driving was all they needed. He'd stolen moms car to go get more whiskey.
Back in the day, allways holding some marajuana, we old hippies learned real good not to flunk the attitude test. A freind of mine, another old hippe, forgot the training last year and got testy with a county sherrif. He tazed the frock out of her, to this day her arm doesn't quite work the same. Her husband, watching this happen, had his cop tear up his shoulder ligaments cuffing him when he got mad. Both his arms don't work right anymore. The whole thing was started by an asshole neighbor who likes to call in bogus complaints about monthly. The whole beef was bogus, but flunking the attitude test got them both charged with resisting a police officer. The tazing was so bogus it all got tossed out of court immediately so the lawyer only cost em $1,500.
Dont' flunk the attitude test.
Waddaya think, you live in a country were cops follow the rules? Ask Rodney King about that.
My brother got sarcastic at a border patrol checkpoint once. Three hours later, after reinstalling his seats in his car, he was on his way.
Don't flunk the attitude test.
Later on, after you get out of either jail or the hospital, the cop isn't even going to apologise. But you will get to pay the med bills, lawyer bills etc.
Don't flunk the attitued test.
What a crock of shit. Did anyone actually watch the video? He didn't pull out the camera until the threatened to ticket him for not having a muffler.
And then the pirates call in every unit in the area in their brand new cars (recession what?), no less than 9 sitting in the lot at one time, all to write him 5 tickets that don't make any sense.
There shouldn't be an attitude test. Police work for us. We should let them know that more often.
http://altlaw.org/v1/cases/446391
" 14
What then is left? Defendant relies heavily on the fact that Duran was making obscene gestures toward him and yelling profanities in Spanish while traveling along a rural Arizona highway. We cannot, of course, condone Duran's conduct; it was boorish, crass and, initially at least, unjustified. Our hard-working law enforcement officers surely deserve better treatment from members of the public. But disgraceful as Duran's behavior may have been, it was not illegal; criticism of the police is not a crime. Houston v. Hill, 482 U.S. 451, 461-63, 107 S.Ct. 2502, 2509-10, 96 L.Ed.2d 398 (1987)."
And then the pirates call in every unit in the area in their brand new cars (recession what?), no less than 9 sitting in the lot at one time, all to write him 5 tickets that don't make any sense.
There shouldn't be an attitude test. Police work for us. We should let them know that more often.
http://altlaw.org/v1/cases/446391
" 14
What then is left? Defendant relies heavily on the fact that Duran was making obscene gestures toward him and yelling profanities in Spanish while traveling along a rural Arizona highway. We cannot, of course, condone Duran's conduct; it was boorish, crass and, initially at least, unjustified. Our hard-working law enforcement officers surely deserve better treatment from members of the public. But disgraceful as Duran's behavior may have been, it was not illegal; criticism of the police is not a crime. Houston v. Hill, 482 U.S. 451, 461-63, 107 S.Ct. 2502, 2509-10, 96 L.Ed.2d 398 (1987)."
mwkeefer
1 MW
I have to agree with all the previous comments on "Attitude Test" especially the old hippie holding theme... I used to subscribe to that thought process, and it's saved me alot of grief over the years.
If the cops told me they were going to write me a ticket for not having a muffler, I would quietly and calmly wait for the officer to finish speaking (they always give you a clear indication when it's your turn to talk, some people confuse that with the guilt stare but it's when they stop talking, never before) and Id make damn sure to keep the grin (which would be festering) off my face because at this point it will burn me and I know it.
Once my turn to speak came, I would tell him it is an electric bicycle or ebike, a purely electronic device (note I didn't call it a vehicle).
If he doesn't do the math that it doesn't need a tailpipe (in keeping with the tone of the thread), IM already frocked! and I would just be plesant and appologize for the "lack of tailpipe"... take whatever else is coming (asking for registration, towing, etc) and do so with as calm a demeanor as possible. In the end, it is an eBike and I've nothing to worry about - the cop who wrote me 5 tickets and towed a bicycle for not having a muffler on the other hand...
At worst the cop would end up ridiculed by his own brothers in blue at best there is a civil case in the makings...
The more likely outcome in my scenario:
The officer wouldn't be a total moron and would get: Electric Only = No Gas = No Muffler
At which point we would either have a laugh as the tension melts away and the officer begins to inquire about the ebike (but not in an I'm gonna get u sukka way) or the officer would bid you good day and you would calmly leave. Don't say anything in the latter situation (safest bet) because HE FEELS STUPID RIGHT NOW... and nothing is more dangerous than a cop who feels humiliated or stupid (remember high school? Remember the dumb jocks? - need I say more, same mental process).
So by just chillaxing through the situation (for my ex head bretheren) normally things will be smooth and uneventful... even the worst case scenario has it's pluses - yea it would be a hassle but think of how stupid you would feel if you were a cop who wrote a ticket for NO MUFFLER on an ALL ELECTRIC VEHICLE?
-Mike
If the cops told me they were going to write me a ticket for not having a muffler, I would quietly and calmly wait for the officer to finish speaking (they always give you a clear indication when it's your turn to talk, some people confuse that with the guilt stare but it's when they stop talking, never before) and Id make damn sure to keep the grin (which would be festering) off my face because at this point it will burn me and I know it.
Once my turn to speak came, I would tell him it is an electric bicycle or ebike, a purely electronic device (note I didn't call it a vehicle).
If he doesn't do the math that it doesn't need a tailpipe (in keeping with the tone of the thread), IM already frocked! and I would just be plesant and appologize for the "lack of tailpipe"... take whatever else is coming (asking for registration, towing, etc) and do so with as calm a demeanor as possible. In the end, it is an eBike and I've nothing to worry about - the cop who wrote me 5 tickets and towed a bicycle for not having a muffler on the other hand...
At worst the cop would end up ridiculed by his own brothers in blue at best there is a civil case in the makings...
The more likely outcome in my scenario:
The officer wouldn't be a total moron and would get: Electric Only = No Gas = No Muffler
At which point we would either have a laugh as the tension melts away and the officer begins to inquire about the ebike (but not in an I'm gonna get u sukka way) or the officer would bid you good day and you would calmly leave. Don't say anything in the latter situation (safest bet) because HE FEELS STUPID RIGHT NOW... and nothing is more dangerous than a cop who feels humiliated or stupid (remember high school? Remember the dumb jocks? - need I say more, same mental process).
So by just chillaxing through the situation (for my ex head bretheren) normally things will be smooth and uneventful... even the worst case scenario has it's pluses - yea it would be a hassle but think of how stupid you would feel if you were a cop who wrote a ticket for NO MUFFLER on an ALL ELECTRIC VEHICLE?
-Mike
Lock
100 MW
I've been stopped well more than a dozen times... I lost count years ago. This for riding an e-legal vehicle where the potential fines on the books are thousands of bucks. Yes, I have always been polite using "sir" and officer" in conversation, and I am sure that never having been seen endangering others has been a plus but in addition I always have introduced into these conversations bits about "...I ride electric `cause my daughters had lung problems when they were young which their doctor attributed to air quality..." So while I always have submitted to their requests (haven't been asked to do a cavity search yet) at the same time I try to introduce a human element to the transaction... (Many might have already divorced - a hazzard of the profession - but still have children...)
One of the last times I was stopped, the officer was plain-clothes on some other assignment but we both had Operators Licences for the Port (to pilot motor vessels) in our wallets and ended up swapping boat stories. So just try'n reduce the "interaction" to human terms. Break down the barriers until eye to eye... Pretty sure the guy in the YT vid got it all wrong.
That is all.
tks
Lock
One of the last times I was stopped, the officer was plain-clothes on some other assignment but we both had Operators Licences for the Port (to pilot motor vessels) in our wallets and ended up swapping boat stories. So just try'n reduce the "interaction" to human terms. Break down the barriers until eye to eye... Pretty sure the guy in the YT vid got it all wrong.
That is all.
tks
Lock
mwkeefer
1 MW
Lock,
Well put.. but there is always that knucklehead cop in almost everytown, that's where tact and instinct come into play... common sense too.
Does the officer look tired? (or on drugs, or coming off drugs, etc)
Is there anything on the officers uniform? (food stains, spills, etc)
How old is the officer? (with age comes wisdom and sense of humor OR bitterness and anger)
How did the officer approach you? (lights from behind, loudspeaker of car, walked up on foot?)
These things all have to be accounted for... while you are correct, most times you end up having a good laugh about somthing... if I were exhaust pipe guy in the YT video... I'd have had somthing like "the only place a muffler would do any good on an ebike would be in my ars" but that would only be if the cop were already responding with good humor when told it's electric (ie: one of the many proper responses from a cop who was just doing his job but was wrong)...
betcha in his position I would have had a YT video of the cops riding my ebike (it doesn't hurt I keep donuts in the panniers - kidding people geez).
I'm only advising caution, read the situation and if you can't do that... don't smirk, yessir and nosir and so on without sounding a smartass and get the hell out of there as fast as possible.
Better to be safe than sorry
-Mike
*EDITED
PS:
In the interest of full disclosure, most of the police I've encountered (all save 2) have been very interested in the eBike and have tried it out (you go ahead and try not to offer a dude with a gun a ride on your bike.. try it atleast you know they are coming back) with the usual EV grin on the return path. I've only had one issue to speak of and that wasn't a big deal... I let the cop write the 5 tickets (no license, no insurance, no inspection, no registration and somthing else I can't remember) which were all promptly dropped before court with nothing more than a visit to the particular district's police chief. I went in quite nicely with an attitude of "I don't want to cause trouble and I really don't want to go to court, Im pretty sure what I was doing didn't require the "blabla" here's what I based it on... am I wrong?"
The result was the chief having the charges dropped before even a prelim hearing and a memo issued to the local police regarding eBikes - the gist being unless someone is being a tool, leave them alone because it's too difficult to prove they violate the federal limits I showed him.
This was a real situation - funny though, the memo told everyone to basically bugger off unless someone was riding like a tool... not because they are all legal but because it would be too difficult to prove an illegal eBike - more credit to the argument, ride normal and dont ride like a tool and you should be fine!
Well put.. but there is always that knucklehead cop in almost everytown, that's where tact and instinct come into play... common sense too.
Does the officer look tired? (or on drugs, or coming off drugs, etc)
Is there anything on the officers uniform? (food stains, spills, etc)
How old is the officer? (with age comes wisdom and sense of humor OR bitterness and anger)
How did the officer approach you? (lights from behind, loudspeaker of car, walked up on foot?)
These things all have to be accounted for... while you are correct, most times you end up having a good laugh about somthing... if I were exhaust pipe guy in the YT video... I'd have had somthing like "the only place a muffler would do any good on an ebike would be in my ars" but that would only be if the cop were already responding with good humor when told it's electric (ie: one of the many proper responses from a cop who was just doing his job but was wrong)...
betcha in his position I would have had a YT video of the cops riding my ebike (it doesn't hurt I keep donuts in the panniers - kidding people geez).
I'm only advising caution, read the situation and if you can't do that... don't smirk, yessir and nosir and so on without sounding a smartass and get the hell out of there as fast as possible.
Better to be safe than sorry
-Mike
*EDITED
PS:
In the interest of full disclosure, most of the police I've encountered (all save 2) have been very interested in the eBike and have tried it out (you go ahead and try not to offer a dude with a gun a ride on your bike.. try it atleast you know they are coming back) with the usual EV grin on the return path. I've only had one issue to speak of and that wasn't a big deal... I let the cop write the 5 tickets (no license, no insurance, no inspection, no registration and somthing else I can't remember) which were all promptly dropped before court with nothing more than a visit to the particular district's police chief. I went in quite nicely with an attitude of "I don't want to cause trouble and I really don't want to go to court, Im pretty sure what I was doing didn't require the "blabla" here's what I based it on... am I wrong?"
The result was the chief having the charges dropped before even a prelim hearing and a memo issued to the local police regarding eBikes - the gist being unless someone is being a tool, leave them alone because it's too difficult to prove they violate the federal limits I showed him.
This was a real situation - funny though, the memo told everyone to basically bugger off unless someone was riding like a tool... not because they are all legal but because it would be too difficult to prove an illegal eBike - more credit to the argument, ride normal and dont ride like a tool and you should be fine!
Lock
100 MW
mwkeefer said:
Hehe... also, forgetfulness... It was always the younger officers fairly fresh from police college that still remembered the rules about power-assist... In my `hood the times they are a changin' (OMG I feel a song coming on...) but until recently none of the older officers had to remember this area of our laws. Their days were only spent dealing w/folks on four wheels...
Lock
dogman dan
1 PW
Nice to know some of ya'all agree with me the dude was being a jerk to the cops by the time he started filming it all. I did watch all of both videos, and that is where I got the feeling he was flunking the attitude test. All that commentary to the camera about the cost of the cops response etc just pissing off the cops more. One comment he made, about why aren't you chasing rapists or something was really stupid. In my town we are just overwhemed with the sunday morning rapes. 
I bet the saturday night shift was plenty busy, with lots of cops wishing they had more backup. I suspect some goofy riding began the whole deal, or even worse, they know him and live to roust him as much as possible. I suspect the reason for so many cops was a call on the radio saying , " hey guess who we have pulled over today?" I had a juvie pot bust once where every cop in town came just to see me in cuffs. They'd been wanting me a loooong time.
I'm not anti cop at all, have some good freinds that are cops now that the drugs are ancient history for me. But I do know better than to piss one off while he has the ticket book out. Argue to the judge, not the guy on the beat. Calm explanations can work, when it's your turn to speak for sure. But those cops surely knew this guy, so nothing he says will be heard. In the end the cop writing the tickets looks stupid, but he doesn't care cause he gets to roust his favorite jackass. The cops are just baiting the guy hoping to get a few tazer darts into this character. All the ticket recipient needs to do is fight it in court, and the cop will simply fail to show up.
I bet the saturday night shift was plenty busy, with lots of cops wishing they had more backup. I suspect some goofy riding began the whole deal, or even worse, they know him and live to roust him as much as possible. I suspect the reason for so many cops was a call on the radio saying , " hey guess who we have pulled over today?" I had a juvie pot bust once where every cop in town came just to see me in cuffs. They'd been wanting me a loooong time. I'm not anti cop at all, have some good freinds that are cops now that the drugs are ancient history for me. But I do know better than to piss one off while he has the ticket book out. Argue to the judge, not the guy on the beat. Calm explanations can work, when it's your turn to speak for sure. But those cops surely knew this guy, so nothing he says will be heard. In the end the cop writing the tickets looks stupid, but he doesn't care cause he gets to roust his favorite jackass. The cops are just baiting the guy hoping to get a few tazer darts into this character. All the ticket recipient needs to do is fight it in court, and the cop will simply fail to show up.
oatnet
1 MW
dogman said:
Damn Skippy!
When I grew up in Philly in the Frank Rizzo years, this pinhead would have earned a night in the roundhouse getting the bottoms of his feet beaten with sand-filled rubber hoses. We learned "yes sir, no sir, I don't know sir" before we learned to ride bikes. Right or wrong, you aren't going to win a pissing contest with a cop, so trying to just makes you look like a dumbass.
I'm not a big fan of the police. Sure 9 cops is overkill. VIdeotape it for the judge and put the commentary on YouTube, insulting them in person isn't going to get you out of the situation. This twerp actually did the entire ebike community a disservice. The next time each of those cops run across an ebiker, s/he will pay for this twerp's mouth.
I'd say he he didn't get $2300 in fines for riding an electric bike - he got them for being a mouthy little goof trying to be more important than the giant "L" tatooed on his forhead reveals. I hope he doubles down on the fines by mouthing off to the judge.
-JD
PS This reminds me of one of my favorite corallaries - don't abuse people who bring your food, aka your waiter or waitress or the hostess. Don't send your food back for some trivial reason, don't be a dick, don't stiff them or complain to management and come back - it doesn't prove how important you are, it just proves you can eat something unsavory without even realiizing it. It has been a few decades since I put myself through college as a cook, but I rember what wait staff did to folks like that. There was a great old saying - someone who is nice to you but a jerk to the witer is not a nice person.
