Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread
- Thread starter GCinDC
- Start date
Doctorbass
100 GW
Longshot said:
Oh I see a great NYX frame here
Well I always recommend to put the controller outside a frame to let it to cool easy. A fan will recirculate air until it become hot and then it will be no longer cooling the controller.
Also the advantage is that you will have shorter phase wires to the motor witch is better!
Doc
Stielz
100 W
Hey guys,
Im keen to wire up a linear hall sensor with magnet on the brake leaver for variable regen. Can anyone tell me whats a good magnet - hall sensor combo?
I've no idea what sort of magnet strength range to expect.. Got some small Neodymium magnets I could use if they aren't too strong (outside the range of a linear hall sensor)
Im keen to wire up a linear hall sensor with magnet on the brake leaver for variable regen. Can anyone tell me whats a good magnet - hall sensor combo?
I've no idea what sort of magnet strength range to expect.. Got some small Neodymium magnets I could use if they aren't too strong (outside the range of a linear hall sensor)
It looks like I will be going the varible regen route as well. There just is not much room for a rear brake disc. I want my brake to feel like a brake. How about a brake pressure sensor that just terminates my hydraulic brake cyclinder? It is 0-2000psi and puts out 1-5 volts.
i have a question about current splitting during charge:
the current coming from the supply, is it the same up to the controller or is it lower after the coil? (current after coil =??? current going into the battery)
maybe a stupid question but im not sure and i need to know for choosing connectors with sufficient current ratings.
the current coming from the supply, is it the same up to the controller or is it lower after the coil? (current after coil =??? current going into the battery)
maybe a stupid question but im not sure and i need to know for choosing connectors with sufficient current ratings.
My Mini-E arrived today. Yay! Another successful delivery for Adaptto. 
I've already hooked it up to a battery just to test it and the display power on ok and it does. Interestingly there were some stat's recorded...although only about 300M worth...so probably just from factory testing.
I won't be using the BMS or the charge coil, so thinking about how best to tuck the connectors out of the way in case I do decide to use them in future. The BMS will probably need to have it's connector removed as it's a bit too bulky to just leave hanging around.
I'm also unsure how to wire up Progressive Regen and the thermistor.
Does anyone have a picture of how they mounted the thermistor in their motor so I can see how best to do it? The thermistor supplied is confusing me since it appears to only have one end that can be soldered with a sticky pad paper square thingy on the other end.
I'm also not sure how it's supposed to be connected. I can see from the manual it uses the 4th pinout of the halls connector, but which end of the thermistor does this connect to and does the other end (if used) share (or even need) the halls ground wire as well?
For progressive Regen using a hall sensor, how is this connected? Does it use the same pin as is listed for a Regen button on the throttle connector? I'm guessing for this to work I need to use a Hall Effect ratio based sensor, not just any old switching type. Like others, I'd be after any recommendations on a sensor magnet combo.
Cheers
I've already hooked it up to a battery just to test it and the display power on ok and it does.
Interestingly there were some stat's recorded...although only about 300M worth...so probably just from factory testing.I won't be using the BMS or the charge coil, so thinking about how best to tuck the connectors out of the way in case I do decide to use them in future. The BMS will probably need to have it's connector removed as it's a bit too bulky to just leave hanging around.
I'm also unsure how to wire up Progressive Regen and the thermistor.
Does anyone have a picture of how they mounted the thermistor in their motor so I can see how best to do it? The thermistor supplied is confusing me since it appears to only have one end that can be soldered with a sticky pad paper square thingy on the other end.
I'm also not sure how it's supposed to be connected. I can see from the manual it uses the 4th pinout of the halls connector, but which end of the thermistor does this connect to and does the other end (if used) share (or even need) the halls ground wire as well?
For progressive Regen using a hall sensor, how is this connected? Does it use the same pin as is listed for a Regen button on the throttle connector? I'm guessing for this to work I need to use a Hall Effect ratio based sensor, not just any old switching type. Like others, I'd be after any recommendations on a sensor magnet combo.
Cheers
Hi maddin88,
It's lower because of the voltage step-up needed to charge the battery.
I have done a test: I put the same current for charge and power supply in the configuration menu (10Amp) and when it starts charging the max current to the battery is 7~8 Amp in my case.
The power supply is capable of 40Amp.
And IMO the output voltage of the power supply will also affect the charging current. With lower voltage psu, more current is needed from the psu for the same charging current.
It's lower because of the voltage step-up needed to charge the battery.
I have done a test: I put the same current for charge and power supply in the configuration menu (10Amp) and when it starts charging the max current to the battery is 7~8 Amp in my case.
The power supply is capable of 40Amp.
And IMO the output voltage of the power supply will also affect the charging current. With lower voltage psu, more current is needed from the psu for the same charging current.
Allex
100 MW
Ducky check my build thread regarding temp sensor wiring.
ridethelightning
1 MW
- Joined
- Jul 21, 2013
- Messages
- 2,010
and with lower psu voltage compared to pack voltage, there will be more losses as the controller tries to step the voltage up higher. i dont want to sound like i know anything, but things just got a lot hotter....
Jackrabbit
100 W
Do you need to set the charge current or does the BMS/controller work it out for you?
I've got a Max-E, I'm going to run 18s 4p Lipo and I'll be using a HP ESP 120 PSU that gives 51ish DCV at around 50A with the Adappto 70A coil. If the controller needs to be set up does anyone know what kind of settings I should use?
I've got a Max-E, I'm going to run 18s 4p Lipo and I'll be using a HP ESP 120 PSU that gives 51ish DCV at around 50A with the Adappto 70A coil. If the controller needs to be set up does anyone know what kind of settings I should use?
Jackrabbit said:
Yes, in the controller setup there is a Charge menu where you set the current to charge, the current of the psu and the max voltage drop permitted in the psu.
You have to go by trial and error to find the nice spot for your charging setup and take in consideration some aspects:
- max charge current that your batteries accept
- max current that your house breakers accept without disconnecting
- temperature of the charging coil and controller
- cable length and size
Jackrabbit
100 W
Thanks. The house breakers, at least the one on the garage will trip at much over 30A. I'm thinking I'll charge at around 20A and use the full 51v from the PSU. The batteries are 8Ah Turnigy Nano Tech which are rated at 25-50c. Would that seem about ok? I'm just looking for ball park numbers that I can tweek as necessary. Thanks.
Jackrabbit said:
According with hobbyking info those batteries have a max charge rate of 5C, so max 40Amp charging.
20Amp charge are ok, you could go till 30amp without problem (just check the temperature of the components during charge).
Jackrabbit
100 W
Thank you. Useful info.
Hi Guys, does the Adaptto MaxE need a pre-charge setup, say ... resistors & a momentary switch.
I notice that in the manual & circuit diagram there is no mention of one. I currently use no pre-charge and just a bridged Anderson connector as a sort of key which I can pull in an out very easily under my seat, this is with my 18fet lyen at 24s and it's been fine with it for over a year (the crack sound doesn't bother me).
I have a twin c63 breaker as Apaptto suggest which I wont use as a switch it will be tucked in the frame just for protection.
How are you guys switching these things on & off.. Maybe the Max E has built in pre-charge? I've aquired most things now to tool up my Raptor Adaptto style, this is one of the last bits to sort.
many thanks
Jon
I notice that in the manual & circuit diagram there is no mention of one. I currently use no pre-charge and just a bridged Anderson connector as a sort of key which I can pull in an out very easily under my seat, this is with my 18fet lyen at 24s and it's been fine with it for over a year (the crack sound doesn't bother me).
I have a twin c63 breaker as Apaptto suggest which I wont use as a switch it will be tucked in the frame just for protection.
How are you guys switching these things on & off.. Maybe the Max E has built in pre-charge? I've aquired most things now to tool up my Raptor Adaptto style, this is one of the last bits to sort.
many thanks
Jon
Doctorbass
100 GW
ridethelightning said:and with lower psu voltage compared to pack voltage, there will be more losses as the controller tries to step the voltage up higher. i dont want to sound like i know anything, but things just got a lot hotter....
I have tested that and there is only few watts loss... at 40A to step up 50 to 90V there is only couple watts loss.
the lower the psu voltage is the higher the controller pwm will have to work to make the coil boost the voltage and the higher the loss will be.
But i have to say i was pretty impressed to see that with tyeh proper inductance it can take as low as 12V 30A to step it up to 90V no prob!.. maybe it's not as efficient as a 50V server psu would do ... but in emergency situation there is plenty of cars taht would accept by ciriosity to lety you recharge your ebike from their battery for couple mile to return home !!! :wink:
Doc
I believe the simplest and safest way to connect to the adaptto BMS is with 4s packs.
I know if you use 6s packs and some of the connections someplace become disconnected you can damage the BMS. I'm not sure how exactly this happens but need to work out the math. It must have to do with the fact that splicing the 6s wires to 4s wires leaves some of the packs connected in series by the balance leads.
My question is if I go with 4s packs to 20s, and then add on 2s packs for 22s, will this be as safe as having all 4s packs. I assume when connecting to the BMS I would plug in the 2s pack into its own BMS 4s connector by itself?
I'm basically trying to find out if 4s-4s-4s-4s is as safe as 4s-4s-4s-4s-2s when connecting to the BMS, in regards to shorting something out somewhere.
I know if you use 6s packs and some of the connections someplace become disconnected you can damage the BMS. I'm not sure how exactly this happens but need to work out the math. It must have to do with the fact that splicing the 6s wires to 4s wires leaves some of the packs connected in series by the balance leads.
My question is if I go with 4s packs to 20s, and then add on 2s packs for 22s, will this be as safe as having all 4s packs. I assume when connecting to the BMS I would plug in the 2s pack into its own BMS 4s connector by itself?
I'm basically trying to find out if 4s-4s-4s-4s is as safe as 4s-4s-4s-4s-2s when connecting to the BMS, in regards to shorting something out somewhere.
Ohbse
10 kW
Offroader said:
Yes - that's safe and no, you won't have any issues, however do you really need that additional little bit of voltage? It's eating into the safety margin and unless you're literally maxing out your current settings you could get that power from a few more amps. If you need more speed then turn up OVS a notch...
My 18650 pack is configured as two layers of 10s10p. Balance connectors are thus 4s-4s-2s-4s-4s-2s with appropriate configuration in the BMS setup. Works great. No linking or complex adapter loom required which is where I believe people are going wrong.
Ohbse, thanks. No I actually don't think I need the 22s. I am probably just going to go 20s and maybe upgrade in the future to 22s if I really think I need to max out my speed.
I may eventually unlock my controller and turn up the phase amps for lower end power and I believe it is better to do this with 20s vs 22s anyway?
Ohbse, could you explain what you mean by this exactly.
No linking or complex adapter loom required which is where I believe people are going wrong.
Or do you basically mean the wiring I have to do in the picture below to get my 6s-6s-6s-6s-4s batteries connected to my BMS? Because if that is what you mean that is exactly why I'm planning on getting all 4s packs. Not for the simplicity alone, but also because in the below picture the controller can be shorted if certain things are connected or disconnected improperly.
I may eventually unlock my controller and turn up the phase amps for lower end power and I believe it is better to do this with 20s vs 22s anyway?
Ohbse, could you explain what you mean by this exactly.
No linking or complex adapter loom required which is where I believe people are going wrong.
Or do you basically mean the wiring I have to do in the picture below to get my 6s-6s-6s-6s-4s batteries connected to my BMS? Because if that is what you mean that is exactly why I'm planning on getting all 4s packs. Not for the simplicity alone, but also because in the below picture the controller can be shorted if certain things are connected or disconnected improperly.
Ohbse
10 kW
Offroader said:
That's exactly right, it's a bit of a nightmare with way too many failure modes. Simply stick to 4s packs (of which there are LOTS of options) or if you're building your own pack, just buy some 4s JST extensions and terminate the balance connectors directly. Just make sure to label them to ensure you get the order right
Doctorbass
100 GW
Offroader said:Ohbse, thanks. No I actually don't think I need the 22s. I am probably just going to go 20s and maybe upgrade in the future to 22s if I really think I need to max out my speed.
I may eventually unlock my controller and turn up the phase amps for lower end power and I believe it is better to do this with 20s vs 22s anyway?
Ohbse, could you explain what you mean by this exactly.
No linking or complex adapter loom required which is where I believe people are going wrong.
Or do you basically mean the wiring I have to do in the picture below to get my 6s-6s-6s-6s-4s batteries connected to my BMS? Because if that is what you mean that is exactly why I'm planning on getting all 4s packs. Not for the simplicity alone, but also because in the below picture the controller can be shorted if certain things are connected or disconnected improperly.
If you want to get max power, keep 20s and dont go 22s !!.. the 2s diff make alot of voltage room for the mosfet and let you gain about 100 more phase amp compare to 22s.
2s more volt compare to 100 more phase amp just does not compare! you are bettwe with 100 more phase amp than adding 2s !
Doc
Thanks Doc, makes it easier for me to stick with 20s. I guess this helps explain why I never had any controller issues with my Lyen 18fet at 18s even with a block time of 10 seconds.
Do you think 18s would be better than 20s? Where would you say is the sweet spot for the Max-E?
Do you think 18s would be better than 20s? Where would you say is the sweet spot for the Max-E?
Doctorbass
100 GW
Offroader said:
Well it depend ALOT on your motor inductance witch vary depending on teh winding.. ex if you have a motor with kv of 12 your controller this is harder on the controller mosfet.. if you have kv of 9 it is easier ad kv of 7 is very easy...
You could use let say 22s on a kv of 7 for the motor but the motor will heat alot...
best would be 20s for a kv of 9 ex: the MXUS 4T with is the best voltage and motor winding compromise i think.
or 18s on a kv of 12 and full phase amp totally safely.
20s on a kv of 12 is ok too but you will not be able to use the full phase amp without any worrie....
Personally i have tried the worst combinaison... a motor with a VERY high speed with a Kv of 18 !!! and 22s.. and after 4 miles i blown a phase on the controller! but guess what! that Bastard was still working !!!
but the motor was vibrating alot.. but i was able to return home with it !!! 
everything was working and the display too !Doc
ridethelightning
1 MW
- Joined
- Jul 21, 2013
- Messages
- 2,010
i run max-e with 22s, typically 120battery amps. i havnt gone crazy overboard with the phase amps, maybe 250-300?max output 10.4kw
and so far no probs with a cromotor 9kv.
im running a mine-e with 20s and x5404(kv?), interestingly it just doesnt have nearly same top speed even with the ovs turned up. maybe 75kph.
although the mini-e is limited to much less amps, maybe 65batt and 100phase,~4kw. i would have thought it would have had roughly similar top speed, just get there slower.
and so far no probs with a cromotor 9kv.
im running a mine-e with 20s and x5404(kv?), interestingly it just doesnt have nearly same top speed even with the ovs turned up. maybe 75kph.
although the mini-e is limited to much less amps, maybe 65batt and 100phase,~4kw. i would have thought it would have had roughly similar top speed, just get there slower.
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