Landyachtz TopSpeed 90mm 10S4P DualRearDrive

[sl33py]

Looks great and ingenious solution!

Nice and clean - besides rain/puddles i think it's about perfect. LIke that it gives you some clamping force. Paired with velcro and some quick release hardware so it's a secondary method for securing the batteries? The quick release (1/4 turn fasteners maybe?) would make it easy to pop off and swap batteries. Likely not what you will use it for since you have the mondo 18650's cell you built, but for the rest of us it's a neat option!

Nice work wp!

 

[whitepony]

confirmation on the 275mm belt. for anyone who is running torqueboard V1 36T with enertion 15T, the 275mm belts are spot on. in shortest motor mount configuration, the belt is just slightly loose, a 270mm belt most likely would not fit!

 

[torqueboards]

Nice guys!

 

[whitepony]

refined the "enclosure" - the aluminum cylinders were too stiff. on the one hand, the topspeed CAN flex afterall, so I felt like it wouldnt work out for very long. on the other hand, all vibrations were transmitted into the GFK plate and the it resonated fairly well. instead Im using these things now to offset the GFK plate by the required 2cm:

while waiting for my order to arrive, I got rid of 2 things: the landyachtz original griptape and the topspeed original graphics which I didnt like very much. went for a "natural" finish, I just love wood really.

been sanding a little and started oiling the roadside of the board. dont have a picture yet of the oiled board, but I oiled some guitars and it gives such a smooth 3dimensionality to wood - love it!

oh yea, you can also see the inserted threads in the wood - they are 8mm deep, outer diameter M8, inner diameter M4. there are a few more now to dampen GFK plate vibrations and hold things into place.

 

[okp]

good job, this definitely adds a personal touch to the landy deck. which grip did you put on ? vicious coarse grip? any special grip design?

 

[Poweralti]

Go go friend only a few more

The battery box will included a mini screen for info?

 

[whitepony]

good job, this definitely adds a personal touch to the landy deck. which grip did you put on ? vicious coarse grip? any special grip design?

not sure yet, currently its natural maple top and bottom

not too fond of vicious griptape cause you keep seeing the small quadratic tiles, no matter how well you apply it. still got black diamond griptape which is very rough and grippy like vicious, but it comes in one part. probably anything but black looks pretty crappy quite fast. although hmm, I used clear tape on one of my boards with a lot of stickers below it - that was a pretty cool look too. overall I enjoy the very natural look that the board currently has ... looks like its handmade.

Go go friend only a few more

The battery box will included a mini screen for info?

Ill most likely add a digital panel that shows current voltage of the battery. got one in red and blue, but not sure yet if I want it or not.

 

[whitepony]

gave it one more round of oil after sanding with 1000grit, but it looks gorgeous already. love the mesmerising look and also touch of well sanded oiled wood <3

its probably really a waste of time, knowing how my boards look like after some use. on the other hand I never crashed my evolve yet cause Im not really trying fancy stuff on these expensive boards. so just mayyybe it will actually last a while

 

[onloop]

At the end of this build I expect a 5000 word SA discussing the meta, the psychology of why you eventually went a DIY build VS an "off the shelf" solution. Some Deep insight. Are you just in it for the build glory or is all about performance?

I think you have a unique opportunity to express your motivations, from your evolve, Your evolve mods. To your diy weapon....

Perhaps even give your insight to the future of the electric skateboard.

 

[whitepony]

Are you just in it for the build glory or is all about performance?

I just love spending my time tinkering and learning. before I discovered the world of longboard, I spent nearly 7 years in motorbike racing and you can guess what was at the receiving end of my tinkering love (175kg, 195 rear wheel hp!). I really enjoy arriving at something that, in my eyes and with my possibilities, is as good as it gets. the evolve is "there" already - there really isnt anything I could do to make this board any better. diy builds have HUGE potential of infinite tinkering until one arrives at this point ... its all about the way! :wink:

gotta admit though, Im really looking forward to the "diy" performance. hoping for boosted on steroids with evolve range and hopefully near pneumatic tire comfort. dream result would be controlled power slides with the rear, but I would probably need different gearing - less top speed, more torque. fingers crossed Ill manage to finish before the german late summer weather is bailing on me!

 

[sl33py]

not too fond of vicious griptape cause you keep seeing the small quadratic tiles, no matter how well you apply it. still got black diamond griptape which is very rough and grippy like vicious, but it comes in one part. probably anything but black looks pretty crappy quite fast. although hmm, I used clear tape on one of my boards with a lot of stickers below it - that was a pretty cool look too. overall I enjoy the very natural look that the board currently has ... looks like its handmade.

I've seen vicious in clear and black in roll form instead of the "tiles"/squares. Not sure if there is anything closer to you since i'm sure shipping makes it too expensive, but here's a link to it at Daddies.

Love the wood finish and looks great wp!!

 

[whitepony]

yesterday I also looked around for that - my favourite board shop eu got them too ( sickboards.nl ). applied black diamond last night though. if original is 1 and vicious is 10 in terms of grip, black diamond is a 9!

 

[kennet_h]

Love the setup!
How wide are the battery pack?
I would like to make a 12S5P, but 3xbattery length might go side to side on the board?

 

[whitepony]

12S5P is REALLY huge, 60cells will net you 600-700Wh like my evolve battery, but most likely the dimensions would be like 54x13x1.8 if you align it like me. probably better if you go for double height with dense triangular packing. dont think 3 cells next to each other would work unless you have a very flat and very wide board (its 20cm wide, most board are 9-10" wide only).

What do you need this huge battery for? For my evolve it was ok, since Im running all terrain setup only, which sucks a lot more energy compared to the street setup - with the street setup and 700Wh, I could run 70km+!! are you aiming at going all terrain or really fast?

my new built battery dimension is 10S4P = 40cells in 2 rows, so pretty much 36x13x1.8cm raw, packed up in heat shrink tube its 37x13.5x2cm! think its a great compromise - 12-13Ah with street wheels is easily 40-50km and I know from experience that I wont last longer really.

 

[chaka]

Ideally you want a pack that under constant use will last 2 to 3 hours, at least that is how the typical 18650 cell will have a long happy life. It will be interesting to see how these high discharge cells perform at a constant 2C since the constant current rating is very low for the HG2 and even lower in the LG HE2 cells used in the "space" packs.

The HG2 is rated at 600mAh constant 20,000max, I would keep an eye on the battery temp since that is the real killer in these batteries under high loads. I am actually working on some gerber files for a temp monitor with digital display for this exact purpose. It would give us an idea of how long we can pull a heavy load without destroying the pack.

 

[whitepony]

hmm, 600mAh is the discharge rating at which the factory capacity is determined. the HG2 has proven to perform really well in the high current discharge capacity measurements I found on the net ... at least when considering its large capacity! :?

 

[kennet_h]

I wouldn't need it for most days, but would like to have it for the days i would.
And i would think that having a larger battery pack, that is not pushed to its limits, would prolong the life of the battery?
I am also a heavy guy(110kg) and i have been skating, and snowboarding, my entire life, even though i don't do it actively anymore, so i would like to be able to go fast.
So my mileage, will probably be worse than most people's?

My deck is 10" (rayne avenger).
I definitely want to go 12S, but not sure on the 3P,4P, or 5P.
It depends on how well i can fit it to the deck, If i'm able to do 5P, without it looking too bad, i will.

Are you happy that you went with the HG2?
I've mostly been looking at the LG HG2, and the Samsung 30Q, but i will do more research, before i decide.
Winter is coming(! :lol: ), here in Norway, so won't have to make a decision on anything, before February.

Does the battery, and brushless motor market, move rapidly? So i would be wise to hold of the purchase, for as log as i can?

 

[chaka]

hmm, 600mAh is the discharge rating at which the factory capacity is determined. the HG2 has proven to perform really well in the high current discharge capacity measurements I found on the net ... at least when considering its large capacity! :?

I am sure it will work great but I think you are missing my point, If you run these batteries at high discharge they will degrade quickly. It all depends on the operating temp, if you run them too hot it will cut the cycle life in half or worse. Some people have noted a 3 to 5 percent drop in capacity after a few discharge cycles at 20amps. This drop in capacity will likely level out once the cathode becomes oxidized which acts as both a protective film and increases resistance but inhibits loss in capacity. The increased resistance also leads to higher operating temps and increased capacity loss and more oxide forming which gives you more resistance and even higher operating temps, a downward spiral.

What we need is some kind of thermoformed bladder/cell tray that we can water cool with a radiator. Could use a radiator made for overclockers or maybe something smaller if we can find it.

One thing that has been bothering me is the lack of gaskets on the positive end of your cells. The nickel strip can cut through that thin heatshrink like butter and short out every cell in parallel. Get yourself some fishpaper and slip some tabs between the nickel strip and the outer ring to prevent this

 

[whitepony]

hm, who is ever going to continuously suck 20A/cell though? if I drew 300+ watts continuously, I'd already be pushing it. 360watts is like 10amp/4 cells for my 4P = 2.5A/cell. on my evolve I usually go full throttle 35kph+ on all terrains - engine is smoking hot, but NEVER ever had any heat in the battery, not even hand warm.

you see, to have different experience on that topic?

 

[chaka]

I always overlook most people don't ride electric boards nearly as fast as DH longboard riders. I've been designing around a cruising speed of 40 to 50 kph. You really don't really see the effects of wind resistance until you breach 40kph and the amp load skyrockets. I easily pull well over 2000watts accelerating to 50 kph on my test board. And to be clear, I do this in the road, not on the sidewalk with pedestrians.

Like I said earlier, if you are not feeling any heat from your cells they should have a long happy life but this pack wouldn't do well or last long if used in a high speed setup like kennet_h wants to build.

In my own experience using an 8s10p pack 50kph is too much and I am likely degrading my pack and that is why I am building a mold for a dropdeck to hold a 240 cell battery system. I need something that can output 2400watts continuous without getting hot or excessive voltage sag with a 4 motor setup.

I'm not sure if you have ever seen what DH is all about but here is a video showing what your board is designed to do in its un-motorized form.
https://youtu.be/5fOVXndyjAo

[youtube]https://youtu.be/5fOVXndyjAo[/youtube]

 

[whitepony]

after watching 2nd nature from sector 9 I just HAD to try DH back then ... spent some weekends practicing coleman slides and variations before I tried downhill the first time - which made me realize that there wasnt really any reasonable spot around my town. its one of the reasons I got into electric skateboarding!

where I live you simply cannot go 50kph anywhere without a deathwish ... so many give ways, so many cars and bicycles. when I go to work in the morning on my evolve, the highest average speed for the whole run has been 30kph and getting there meant I was just going reckless on quite a few corners - if a car had come, I'd be toasted now.

my diy thing is an experiment - I think I might feel comfortable at 50kph after a while, but its something Ill do on special occasions and with protective gear which I usually dont wear when I get into the office.

once i got all my parts, ill report about battery heat on the HG2 - think my setup can be quite hungry too if I push it.

 

[whitepony]

originally I wanted to wait for the replacement ESCs from torque, because he thinks something isnt right about the ones I got right now BUT it was one of the last nice days for a while and I just had to try the board. used some leftover heatshrink tube to fixate all electronics roughly on my fiber plate and just went for a ride.

must say, it looks really pretty sleek, just the absolute minimum enclosure, I actually like the idea of the heat shrink tube too - its quite waterproof, fixates the battery nicely on the fiber plate and everything is super dampened by the 6 rubber cylinders that connect the fiber plate to the board. think Ill just keep it like that for a while. didnt shorten the cables yet since I have yet to return the ESCs, so I just loosely taped them to the enclosure.

dont even know where to start to be honest, it was a really really great experience. first of all I just LOVED the landyachtz topspeed, I felt super comfortable with the locked in feet, new griptape is really great too, the riptide krank 87A on the caliber2 work supersmooth, same with the giant abec wheels with the huge shockpads - its REALLY a great feel on that ride. smooth, quite turny, nice grip, much better than the kegels I was using on the evolve.

the board has nearly no drag - was a 3-4% downhill slope and the board was accelerating on its own. turned on nunchuck while rolling, it coupled right away and I started from 10kph - torque blended in fairly smooth until top speed which was something like 20kph. :? I really need to configure the escs in some way to actually get to 50kph I guess? first impression was: very smooth, quite silent actually, no weird noise from the enclosure or components (had put a felt sheet on the fiber plate to avoid any rattling of electronics - that seemed to be working nicely.

was riding 2-3km, just carving through the dark and enjoying the great turny calibers, then I carefully tried the brake on the nunchuck and it basically threw me off felt like I was running into a wall. I certainly need to configure the ESCs a little. at the same time I was getting really exited, cause the torque that made the board stop with pretty much sliding tires will be there for acceleration too if I just send in the raw signal. those 2 outrunners are a monster

will be hard to sleep tonight


p.s.: screw the night, been going on a 10km tour in the end, probably shoudnt have cause I rumbled over a few stones and got my first scratches on motor mount and motor but hey, thats unavoidable anyway. still, its always the first scratches that hurt the most :wink:

 

[chaka]

Sounds like the brakes are turned off and the ESC is trying to go in reverse. Congrats on the shakedown cruise!

 

[onloop]

It will be interesting to see how these high discharge cells perform at a constant 2C since the constant current rating is very low for the HG2 and even lower in the LG HE2 cells used in the "space" packs.

Actually 2C is nothing for these cells, That's just 5A discharge current? 5c & 10c also no problem...

What is the source of your info? - please link to it because it is misleading you and now your misleading others.

What does "even lower" actually mean? Please explain.

I easily pull well over 2000watts accelerating to 50 kph on my test board

Pulling lots of watts is not somthing you really want to be boasting about. We should all be discussing how we can pull less watts and achieve good performance.

For instance i belive your drive train is ineffecient. 20:32 is 1.6:1 reduction. It's WAY too low. Also Your motor rpm is a bit too low also. Ideally want to near 8000. Can you explain why you built it this way?

You really need to try to get your RPM higher! Otherwise your watts are just turning into heat and not providing propulsion.

If you build a better drive train your battery will also last longer each charge due to less watts being used and overall battery life will be improved.

 

[onloop]

Ideally you want a pack that under constant use will last 2 to 3 hours, at least that is how the typical 18650 cell will have a long happy life.

Also wondering what this means? Please explain the logic behind this concept.

Normally the run time of a battery is determined by how many WH the pack is and how many avg watts you consume.

Wether a cell is being used safely and conservativley within its rated spec is not directly related to its capacity.. also there is no such thing as a typical 18650. They are all very different...capacity & discharge rates differ massively..

For instance. You can have a small capacity battery. Say just 6s3p around 160WH and you could use the battery capacity rather quickly (maybe just 30min) but the battery would still be working within its "safe" range of discharge if the cells are rated to discharge at the rate you are discharging them.

You could also have the same 6s3p capacity pack made with cells that are not suitable and it would be harmful to over discharge it.

The total capacity, or "lasts 2 to 3 hours" is not the best way to determine if the battery is suitable.

The rate at which you discharge/charge is what can harm a battery. Of course really large batteries (with many parallel groups) tend to be able to handle more abuse, higher discharge rates, but it is not a logical approach to a propulsion system design. Also asthetically & functionally it might not make much sense to have a 3 hour size battery.

My advice is If you want to avoid over discharging your batteries build a more effecient drive train.

Or use current limiting to prevent over discharging

Fuses & current limiting will also protect other electronic components. Motors don't like overheating either.