Mars Electric LLC Axial Flux Motor

Jeremy Harris

Jeremy Harris

100 MW
Joined
Oct 23, 2007
Messages
4,208
Location
Salisbury, UK
Well, I'm a bit pissed off.

Unlike one or two on here I've no history with this guy, so don't have any prejudices.

However. I've spent around 5 hours today doing some detailed analysis of the axial flux motor design that he detailed on here, only to find that all my work has been deleted by the mods. Needless to say, I'm not a happy bunny, as all that work seems to have been just binned. Why did I bother?

Despite all the prejudicial crap about this guy, he had seemed to find an interesting motor design, one that looked as if it may well have had potential for some development. For reasons unknown to me I, and others, are now to be denied the chance to look at this in more detail, which frankly stinks. I don't care about the past history from other forums that I'm not privy too, I'd rather judge people on the basis of personal experience. Notwithstanding my concerns over the fidelity of some of the data I think the decision to delete my hard work, with no explanation, is simply unacceptable.

Goodbye.

Jeremy

Edited to change thread title to be more correct. Old thread title was "Randy's Axial Flux Motor"
 
I permanately left an engine forum over the same thing. Spent hours of my time working the numbers, mods deleted the thread over some vendor/sponsor disagreement BS. I told them they could restore my work or pay my $48.75/hr for 3hrs to cover the work I had performed vollentarily as an open-domain contribution. They though I was bluffing. I never posted again, their forum tanked and failed in a few months.
 
The data isn't deleted, looks like it was just moved to a private forum for some reason. Lets see what we can do.
 
Jeremy Harris said:
I don't care about the past history from other forums that I'm not privy too, I'd rather judge people on the basis of personal experience.
Click to expand...

soo, if some old guy living in exile in Paraguay logging on here as say, Adolf_H, as long as he has some kik-ass motor available for cheep & made the trains run on time you'd be down with that?

(this is in no way not at all a comparison of draper to pur evil, just like to know to what extent you believe in your statement/position.)
 
As leary as I am of "Randy" I am interested in ths motor. Sensureing someone fo being a dick is one thing.....making information from more than one source disapere is another issue altogether.

Just letting the guy re-join with another name was permission for him to post the info & start the discovery. If he was truely "banned" then he should have been booted the minute he was recognised. Any one can debate if the thread would bear fruit but to make it disapear seems a bit nazi to me.

I can still read Safes posts even here. AssieJester is banned for not playing well with others on another site, but his content is there for consumption.

Not impressed with the reactionism. from members or moderators on this touchy subject.
 
Censoring or moving someone's post into neverland is, in terms of offensiveness, as bad as banning someone.

I hope this is resolved. I haven't been around here very long, but Jeremy seems to be an intelligent and valuable member of ES from what i've read. Hate to see good people go.
 
well, I still have randy's contact info as I predicted this might happen. I followed that thread for its barely over a day life and was pretty dissapointed in all three parties involved but I feel that putting differences aside and being tolerant in the spirit of progress is important. at $150 I still think I will give the motor a try, I would be willing to chip in to get one in the hands of say jeremy to see what is really going on with it.

so we have a new thread, sans motordude now, lets all throw some $ in the cup and give it a try. a cheap motor that doesn't need a whole new controller and components designed for it that is ready NOW is needed in the meantime.

/don't leave jeremy
 
Jeremy Harris said:
Well, I'm a bit pissed off.

Unlike one or two on here I've no history with this guy, so don't have any prejudices.

However. I've spent around 5 hours today doing some detailed analysis of the axial flux motor design that he detailed on here, only to find that all my work has been deleted by the mods. Needless to say, I'm not a happy bunny, as all that work seems to have been just binned. Why did I bother?
Click to expand...
Hi Jeremy,

I hope you still retained the work you posted at ES? I'm sure you can re-post this in a new thread about this motor design... your work will not be binned and gone to waste.

What this person was offering should not have been allowed to remain in the "new" For Sale area. This was/is a vaporware motor that was not even in a "tested prototype" positioned to sell stage, but it was/is, rather, in position to be discussed "in theory" about its potential as a new motor design that could be offered for sale AFTER prototypes and testing...

First things, first, right? :)

Jeremy Harris said:
Despite all the prejudicial crap about this guy, he had seemed to find an interesting motor design, one that looked as if it may well have had potential for some development. For reasons unknown to me I, and others, are now to be denied the chance to look at this in more detail, which frankly stinks. I don't care about the past history from other forums that I'm not privy too, I'd rather judge people on the basis of personal experience. Notwithstanding my concerns over the fidelity of some of the data I think the decision to delete my hard work, with no explanation, is simply unacceptable.
Click to expand...
You don't have to judge Randy for nothing other than the *present way* he posted on his thread at ES...

1) When asked by me to explain his experience or background about this motor, he never did. Instead, he spent a lot of time "up front" responding with childish "attacking" one-liners directed at respected and longtime ES members. As a result of that, one very respected ES member quit ES in protest, unless this PREVIOUSLY BANNED person remained banned. Please note *how* Randy came online into ES... He signed-in under another new name w/no posting history, hiding the fact he was *already* banned from ES, and he would not admit to who he was despite other ES members finding out or knowing whom he was/is. Sort of spamming ES once again? ...and I know *you* don't appreciate or will respond to anyone with that type of manipulation.

2) He showed old videos (made many years ago) which detailed NOTHING about the motor he was promoting! Simply rides off-road on what? Nothing!

3) By your own study of this motor design the numbers did not add-up on this mystery motor, so we never knew if there was a prototype with testing done or not. Randy should have stated what he had immediately at the very beginning!

4) He gave no proof of concept or any way where/how it would be manufactured, again, he should have provided this information upfront in a "New For Sale" area, immediately, especially, when asked by more than one ES member for this same information. He did not do it after being asked more than once.

Jeremy, you can PM me for some more info I have too. I hope your goodbye is VERY TEMPORARY. You are a highly regarded mentor to ES membership, and excellent contributor, and I was one of your virtual apprentices. You contribute too much here and are too valuable to ES members to say "goodbye"? :shock: How many others on ES have your life-experience and decades of learning... ???

Please return ASAP...

You are very much appreciated here and do not need to leave over this matter. If you want to offer more ideas about this motor design, then please proceed to start a new "motor design" thread about it. Randy had motor-vaporware, but maybe you can interest someone else on ES to move this design towards some prototypes at least. :wink: :mrgreen:

Thanks for your consideration...

Respectfully, deVries
 
Other than outright slander...what reasons are there for just pulling a whole thread....
 
Hey guys.. sorry for the outcome but this is the way it has to be.

I am member on a few Yahoo groups where Randy has been posting and still does over the last 5+ years i've been subscribed, he is the way he is and has no intention of changing. It's like asking the lion to not eat the bunnies, being polite and sharing accurate information is not in his repertoire.. he repeats himself on yahoo all the time and the numbers are never the same, he makes stuff up all the time and averages things best he can remember at the moment... all incoherent most of the time.

It is impossible to please everyone, i do the best i can 7 days a week but i canot spend 24 hrs a day ( tho i do spend alot of time here ) .. i woke up from a 6 hr sleep to a 4 page thread that had already taken place, had i noticed him on the spot i would have put the hammer down right away but i decided to let it go a while to see if by " chance " he could actually manage to get along with the crowd.. Since many postings had already been made and i hate to remove valuable content, unfortunately sometimes it has to happen.. it's impossible to prune a thread and let it go when the OP canot comment.

Problem is that there is alot and i mean ALOT of history here, the only way this will ever work is for someone to handle the Public Relations end of the deal while Randy stays away quietly, and i'm not in no way in hell volunteering for that job.

The postings are not deleted, i moved the whole thing to the mod area while we discuss the best course of action.. we still are..

I quote a line form his last public post " Looks like all the forum cry babies are getting bored anyway " .. yeah.. nice going.. instead of staying positive and encouraging progress, he throws a bucket of blood in the shark water..

sorry guys.. but randy will no longer be on ES. check " Power-assist " on yahoo groups if you want to communicate with him there.
 
Hi,
I do know that my post is redundant but ...Please Jeremy don't leave the forum :)
I do REALLY mean what I write!! To illustrate my words I promise to pay you a beer (a good one) the next time you come in Bayern :)
Concerning the axial flux motor story, I didn't read it, but I do know( I've build my PM generator) that this theme is quite a "burning one" as soon as a lot of "illuminated scientist" claim they reinvent the wheel, and this every year.
I hope all this is only an insignificant misunderstanding that won't have any influence on your (really appreciated) presence on this board!
Gruß from Regensburg,
H.
 
I appreciate that this board is moderated on a volunteer basis and that the mods time is valuable too. I'd vote for bringing the locked thread back with some kind of TROLL disclaimer on all of Randy's posts. After all, nothing can stop him from doing it again and there would just be more of us aware that the thread was about to be locked.

I wanted to add a Perm motor price list from 2006 to the thread. The 1KW Perm PMS 080 that was discussed in the thread was listed at 309 Euros for one piece.
Perm 2006 price list
 
I must have blinked, because I seem to have missed the whole thread under discussion.

So, I don't know what was in it, but the idea of a whole thread being removed worries me. ES is actually such a nice place to hang out and discuss things. I like the way people here can disagree politely and stay friends. Both Jeremy and I have quit a UK forum that covers much the same ground as ES because of the attitude there.

This is usually a pretty tolerant place. Bad ideas get shown up by discussion rather than by being banned. There is another thread going on right now - http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=23058 I happen to think there are some really stupid views being expressed there, and the danger than someone is going to get killed by taking them seriously. But I'm not suggesting removing it, let the discussion carry on and the views get analysed. After all, people on here quite often discuss dangerous and illegal behaviour without censure. I'm just wondering what could possibly have been said in a discussion about motors that's more outrageous.

I hope the mods come to a good conclusion (I don't envy their job) and Jeremy ends up happy to stay.

Nick
 
The fellow posted about a 65KV motor design here under motor tech, he was looking to get someone to order 50 of them so he could have a factory make them. If it were already for sale somewhere i'm sure there would be people trying them out.

They moved it to the for sale section. The fellow got quite abrasive and was denegrading various old projects and someone recognized his style and references. Last I saw they were offering to let him continue that one thread under for sale as long as he stayed out of all other threads.

I don't know the history but if the moderators do and feal that banning him pre-emptively is neccessary. That he would certainly cause a lot of harm before eventually getting banned anyway. Its a good thing. If he is known to be untrustworthy then removing him before someone buys into his $7500 deal is wise. If he is known to make up numbers - nothing I hate more than needing to un-learn something false.
 
Ypedal said:
The Locked Thread About a Not Yet For Sale Motor
Click to expand...
Thanks Ypedal... at least the thread is back with Jeremy's data perfectly intact. We will all get to see if "Randy" is for real or not, since I see he posted he will sell his 50 motors on eBay. ...when and if he ever gets these built for sale, that is...
Randy said:
I trust what this motor desinger that builds these motors to spec says. I will run one on my ebike to see how it matched the motors I make for power and efficiency. When you see them on Ebay anyone can buy them if they like to if I dont sell all 50 at one time before then.
Click to expand...
Remains to be seen... :wink:
 
I agree regarding locking a thread rather than deleting it is a good course of action.

I must apologize to the forum members here who were affected by this situation.

For those who do not know, I am the source of friction in Randy's motor thread. Bear in mind, I merely reacted when he was rude to me. Without going into too much detail, I dealt with FAR more garbage from him over the years than ANYONE should ever have to deal with. Also, to those who say it should all stay in the past I say this------ #1 Randy does not let it go. Why do you NOT say that to him? #2 He has always, and continues to poke his drivel at me, personally, constantly. I have taken it far too long. A person has to speak up at some point. #3 Randy was banned NUMEROUS times from this forum and continues to return. I was INVITED to this forum. I did not spam or troll my way on.

I reacted because of the personal attack he gave me on that thread, not because of the history I have with him. I reacted the WAY I did because of the history I have with him.

I appreciate this forum more than I can communicate. However, a ban is a ban. I do not see any way around it. Also, why is it I get hammered when I hit Randy back, but he gets defended? This I am completely baffled by.

At any rate, enough is enough. I am sorry to drag anyone into something that was, in any way, offensive to them. I know those who are angry at me have no idea exactly what I went through and, therefore, I am not offended by their anger toward me.

Matt
 
I feel he has the best e- bike(not moped) I have ever ridden ... and I have ridden a few.

I read everthing I can of his about e-bike motors and drives.

Is the planet Rider Motor available ?... if not then his current offering should be considered equally with others out there made for a E-BIKE

I wish some e-bike (not moped) riders could ride his bike. The Pedal cadence and motor and 3speed are beautifully matched.
 
jmygann said:
I feel he has the best e- bike(not moped) I have ever ridden ... and I have ridden a few.

I read everthing I can of his about e-bike motors and drives.

Is the planet Rider Motor available ?... if not then his current offering should be considered equally with others out there made for a E-BIKE

I wish some e-bike (not moped) riders could ride his bike. The Pedal cadence and motor and 3speed are beautifully matched.
Click to expand...
Might I suggest that you could be a filter for him here on ES about this motor? His ideas or offerings, etc. ONLY have to be pre-screened for unbecoming communications not fit for personalization directed at ES members.

Just have him send you his post, and you make sure the unwanted editorial opinions are removed before you post it for him. Heck, I'll screen a few if need be to satisfy the interested ES members in this motor.

He stated he is not the designer/maker of this motor, so he has someone else doing this. As an alternative, we could contact the designer directly too.

This would be an excellent method to not lose a great design or eBike motor, especially, since you have experience with this yourself. Has Randy been building many eBikes for years? What is his expertise? You are happy to recommend his eBike despite the irritation he has caused.

Thanks for your consideration of these ideas... :)

P.S. Maybe this person would be willing to pre-screen Randy's posts too?...
gestalt said:
well, I still have randy's contact info as I predicted this might happen. I followed that thread for its barely over a day life and was pretty dissapointed in all three parties involved but I feel that putting differences aside and being tolerant in the spirit of progress is important.
Click to expand...
I bet we could get to the heart of this matter in 5-10 posts from Randy or the motor designer. Just need to have a temporary filter on it to find out... And, I'll volunteer if no one else will... I just don't know much about Randy or motors... but I can get rid of the crapola in a jiffy... :twisted:

Glad you're back Matt... :wink:

Now, Jeremy can come back too! :!: Maybe Jeremy can keep in contact with Randy off ES to find-out whether this is worth pursuing too? There are some simple work-arounds to keep everyone happy about this situation.

:mrgreen:
 
A large number of feeder sites carrying Bob Diodes advertisements for an alternator motor into a single site.
Bob Diode found the alternator thread on page 11 on a motor building thread on Rc groups.
He posted a wondrous new approach to an inexpensive giant sale rc motor, an alternator based on a windmill setup inside a delco alternator housing.

A great deal of interest was generated. The real motor builders started asking questions about his claimed 20 hp super efficient alternator motors.

He eventually drove all the knowledgeable motor builders away.

Now he built his distribution system.
Feeder sites into a deserted thread on Rc Groups feeding customers to an Ebay site.

The Ebay site had a very large disclaimer Windmills only If you burn out the alternator it is yours. No warranty.

So many people complaind that all of Bob Diodes ads were purged from the thread on Pc Groups.
From page 11 to page eighty hundreds of blank posts by Bob Diode.

Bob Diode finally posted a series of videos that were so misleading that the admins ordered him to delete them also.

He changed his handle to Elipobiker and re posted the offending you tube videos..

The admins deleted the entire thread including 11 pages of wiring diagrams formulae, that were there before Bob Diode co opted the thread.
E lipo biker is aleady posting feeder threads into the Locked thread here.

Feeder threads to endless sphere to e lipo bikers Ebay site.
You handle the outraged customers . He handles the money LOL
 
Ok, following YPedal's link:http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/power-assist/message/93526

Re: [power-assist] Re: The first 750 Watt BLDC Mini-Etek Disk Motors are ready for production I have a couple of these if you are interested. We have one set up for a mid drive, by mounting a Cyclone gearbox on it. For 200 bucks, I will send it out to you. I have the original, as these were created for a Euro Floor scrubber, with the original gear reduction. It's kind of a cast monster thing, but all bolted up and ready to deliver. from Josh at runabout cycles
Click to expand...

Two posts later Josh said:
Well, this motor is about 5 lbs, and it did need a gear reduction. The Cyclone Garage door opener is hard to beat, cost wise, for sure. But this Floor scrubber motor was built to grind, 750 continuous duty. Fair to say, it took us a while to locate such an inexpensive beast.
Click to expand...

So does this imply the motor is a floor scrubber motor, or the heritage is based on a floor scrubber motor from the continent?

One like this? http://cy.rsdelivers.com/product/karcher/9533805/floor-scrubber-bds-33-190c/0146787.aspx or this 800 watt one? http://www.karcher.com/int/Products/Professional/Scrubber_driers/Singledisc_machines/12912040.htm

What do you guys think? There are a bunch of you in Britain and on the Continent... search out your cleaning people at work and start taking their big industrial floor scrubbers apart! We should be able to find the core of this motor if the facts above are right and are in the context of the motor previously posted... could it be? Somebody is manufacturing an axial flux motor for a floor scrubber? What a hoot that would be...

EDIT: Look what one more google search turned up: It's cheap too, $200 bucks Retail! It was for a battery operated scrubber and has a 5/1 gearbox!!

I think I found the motor! >>> http://www.marselectricllc.com/pmsm-scrubber-motor.html

yhst-57437235823410_2130_738728


Or this one cost $120: http://www.marselectricllc.com/pmscmo1.html

yhst-57437235823410_2130_827904


This is a slow speed, high torque PMSM motor with internal speed control. No gear box. Designed for battery operated equipment and 36 VDC systems. The motor will run at 320 rpm constant speed, or can be reset to 220 rpm constant speed. Variable speed is also possible with the use of an external 0-5K Ohm resistor. Current limit of 30 amps peak, and 22 amps continuous.

At 22 amps, the torque is 240 Pound inches (20 Ft Lbs)

Totally enclosed design. Weight of 39 pounds. Motor weight is 34 pounds when the Control is removed. Three internal hall sensors provide the rotor position indication at 120 electrical degrees.
Click to expand...
 
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