MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

brumbrum said:
madin88 said:
brumbrum said:
So the 12t will definitely fit the mxus 3000? That is a dream freewheel come true.

Anyone know if its a 3/32" or 1/8" ?

It will definitely fit on motors with M14 Axle, but not sure if it also fits the Versions with M16 Axle.
The thread is the same as on Cromotor if that helps.

Arh, ok. Will check with Merlin. I have a cro and mxus v.3 but off the top of my head they both have 16mm axle.
Cheers.

My 12t freewheel is 1/8".
 
The freewheels are a result of Kinaye and I getting mxus to stock them for us.

The m16 axle is barent's design which we did deliberately to use our 12t freewheels.

They do not fit qs (whose axle metal has been a bit poor since 2013 and needs the extra thickness).

I am surprised mxus is handing them out but they seem to be handing our axle design for v3 and fatbike as well. Maybe time to develop a new vendor. Group buys are killing off any return on effort.


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Well not sure about freewheels Sambo, but I had them deliver those freewheels to me all the way back when I started this thread. The do cost extra of course, so nothing they throw in for free.
 
There are many people that make this hobby and forum continue to evolve and both of you have played importants parts :wink: .....but neither of you are ever going to compete with industrial Chinese man power and sales technique
 
No but when it comes to deciding who gets the right to make a 45mm v4 they may not get the gig.

Gave them plenty of opportunities to make me a 35mm v2 also and ended up schooling that with a different supplier and the result looks great. Possibly with heatsinking the 45mm is now not needed in many instances except by people who need to make large power claims to feel good.

It takes a lot of time to develop these things to bring to market. Pays to get a return on it or my family tends not to eat. And the products stop getting developed.

Even several of the v3 buyers out there who wanted to save a few bucks ended up missing the different bearings or curved magnets or got random axles and connectors. Or got screwed by the vendor on the unit price going direct.


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The hazy days of a strong sterling GBP has now been washed down the toilet pan, so for me as a consumer its now going to be very hard exchanging my pound to other currencies. Probably a better idea is to try and find a niche product here in the U.K and become seller lol.
I remember some years back it was £1 to $2usd , soon it is going to be £1 to $1.1usd.
But i do agree with you, quality control is absolutley unpredictable from the east, but so is business alliance.
 
Thats true. I actually got a local aussie ask me for a price some time ago for a v3, proceed to ask a million questions, bought it twenty bucks cheaper on alibaba, paid thirty more for freight, cooked a hall and expected me to warranty it for free.

Then was astounded to find out the curved magnets hadnt been released yet despite the aliexpress vendor declaring it did have all the ingredients of a real v3.

Still chuckling.


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Sambo, on v4 I expect to see a ferrofluid edition. Thats is - stamped steel stator! Back to basics that is, and working to get the heat OUT of the hub instead on collecting in inside the cast alu stator. By this we also have a weight reduction which will always be positive.
 
Allex, i guess you are referring to the V1 MXUS which has lower weight?
I believe the lower weight of the V1 (MXUS and Cromotor as well) is because of the 0,5mm lams which have larger inner diameter and thus less iron.
I don't know why they did change that diameter when they made the lams thinner (from magnetic properties or performance it is useless addition of iron).
A guess would be that those thinner lams are too fragile when handling so it is for more strength during assembly..

The aluminum stator holder itself should have lower weight compared to the steel version, and with aluminum there is a BIG benefit in view of "filtering" heat spikes. Heat dissipation to the outside doesn't change so the motor will give off the same thermal energy, with the only difference it can store more inside.
In practice this means, with an aluminum stator holder, the time before the motor overheats during abuse will be longer, but it also will take longer until it had cooled down again :)
 
Personally, I like when the motor cools down faster, I like how my Leaf works in that way - if it hits up, I just need to drive calm a few minutes to get ok temp.
I did not know that alu stator weights less than stamped! In this case we can leave it at how it is.
 
I'm almost done getting my MXUS 3000 Turbo motor hooked up. Then I will be able to make a direct comparison between a Cromotor v3 and the MXUS 3000 turbo. Everything else the same including, bike, controller, and 17"x3.00 wheel.

I only saved about 5 lbs by switching over. I thought it would have been more. The MXUS 3000 turbo weighs more than the older MXUS motors because it has a beefed up axle and larger phase wires.

The Cromotor v3 is not as powerful as the QS205 with extra copper fill, it is also not as heavy. The QS205 weighs about 1 kg (2 lbs) more than the cromotor v3.

If the MXUS 3000 Turbo can get close to performance as my Cromotor v3, then I would say it is probably the motor to use as my Cromotor has plenty of power.

I'm going to be testing it using the same exact adaptto settings, except autodetect of course.

Only thing that sucks is it is so cold and wet out which doesn't make driving off-road easy.



 
found that now,

i have 2 raptors 140

MAX-E / 17" Rearwheel / MXUS v3 4T /63Kg
MID-E / !7" Rearwheel / QS204 4T /52kg

can switch immediately the bikes. You feel it on the first ride....on the first throttle that the mxus has not that torque of the bigger QS.
no matter that my Raptor is 11-12kg more weight.
the bigger QS pulls much more.

Same Phase amps, same DC amps to compare.

but the biggest "Problem"
the MXUS runs without FF atm. I can heat it up in Minutes if you run it with 10kw. Its good for my girl. but for me ...ehh....does not fit the application :p

yea, iam a junkie, guillty....but i will build another bike, light as possible, with a 3T Mxus with FF and Hubsinks.
tried a BBS HD for a few days. not bad but 1,7Kw is not enough for a junkie :D
 
Merlin said:
found that now,

i have 2 raptors 140

MAX-E / 17" Rearwheel / MXUS v3 4T /63Kg
MID-E / !7" Rearwheel / QS204 4T /52kg

can switch immediately the bikes. You feel it on the first ride....on the first throttle that the mxus has not that torque of the bigger QS.
no matter that my Raptor is 11-12kg more weight.
the bigger QS pulls much more.

Same Phase amps, same DC amps to compare.

but the biggest "Problem"
the MXUS runs without FF atm. I can heat it up in Minutes if you run it with 10kw. Its good for my girl. but for me ...ehh....does not fit the application :p

yea, iam a junkie, guillty....but i will build another bike, light as possible, with a 3T Mxus with FF and Hubsinks.
tried a BBS HD for a few days. not bad but 1,7Kw is not enough for a junkie :D

Merlin, do you notice any difference between the weight of the motors? Does the lighter MXUS ride better?
 
Hard to say because my fat Raptor is >12kg more. this weight you feel pretty sure.
and handling/lifting is with 4kg less weight also noticeable.

riding on street i would not care about the weight from the 4kg rear wheel penalty.


if you ride the fat raptor maybe 20km and switch the bike, it feels switching to a bicylce.
switching back to the fattie, feels like steering the titanic.


but all of this is only for a short time.

my girl is riding more an more in the woods, straight to, not on the woody ways.
i have to "work" alot more with my heavy raptor. but i like it in a ....ehh strange way.

if a motocross or enduro guy switch from his 350 or 450 gas bike (that weights 50KG MORE (!!!) to my "fat raptor"
he has the same feeling switching from a heavy raptor to a lighter.

a real comparing to a gas bike should be a trial bike.
250ccm Gas Gas should be the same weight as my raptor ...yea center of gravity on a trial bike is way lower and that handling is way better.
but from a normal ride its "similar"

no one would say after a ride with a trial bike: oh that bike is freakin heavy.
no he would say wtf, this is crazy light.

i like.....i really! like the lightweight raptor....it makes in this or that situation 'more' fun.
but i like (really :p) also the Big Bang of the heavy one + the stable feeling on 100kph+

i switched last week my HOPE top crown from my Fox40 to the stock one and took a nice piece of CNC art on it...
Angle adjustable on the fly.

2016-12-02%2022.11.30.jpg


now i sit alot more upright. A DREAM for long rides + A DREAM for standing position rides....a dream in any way.
the look is ...ehh..takes getting used to but the ride is AWESOME!

as i posted in another topic, riding a cross bike the handlebar is way higher then on our "bicycle" riding positions.

VO3-DVD-1-cover-1-300x257.jpg


Before:

2016-11-18%2020.48.22.jpg


Now:
yup have to clean my table i know :p

20161215_014546.jpg




.......ouhm...back to topic....


i think its just a decision of the personal taste.
some like it, some not, some only need 3-5kw, others want way more.

you have a 55 inch LED flat screen....you like it, fantastic picture right?
....till you sit in front of a 4K OLED display....switching back frocks you any time you watch a movie (if you addicted to :p)


know what i mean?
if you know your QS205 very well.....using a maxe controller with up to 17kw in boost mode, its just (abit) disappointing switching to normal mode with (example) 10-12kw.
...you will miss something....but after a time youre feelings are used to this. (DONT SWITCH NOW TO BOOST MODE ;P)

if you ride your mxus with FF and Hubsinks up to 10-12kw...probably its the sweet spot of wasting energy for fun :)

let us know what you find out.
 
I do fully agree with you Merlin. BUT, it hink you live in a hilly area…
we are fully in the mountains and with my hub motors I can go for 500 m in height and than it overheats. Going slower it doesn't help. FF makes some slight differences. I'm waiting for Hubsinks…
So when I'm going out in the mountains and I want to go further, I always use my BBSHD and I don't have overheating problems. The bike weights half and don't forget, using 1.500W you are using also much less battery. It makes the battery cheaper, smaller and lighter, also the charger.
And when I want to have wheelie fun I'm using my Rapto with QS205 V3 until it overheats.
As a alternative I have ordered some MXUS V3, they will be available soon for all of you. I want to build lighter bike and see how that is going.
 
Does anyone know the max safe temp I can bring my MXUS 3000 Turbo without damage to the magnets?

Merlin, it seems you think the QS205 is way more powerful than the MXUS Turbo. You may be correct. However, I heard someone else comparing the Cromotor to the MXUS turbo and he said they are close in performance. It may be possible that the QS205 is a lot more powerful than the cromotor. The Cromotor supposedly has a 48mm wide stator vs the MXUS at 45 mm Stator.



You are comparing the QS205 which weighs 12.8kg vs MXUS turbo which weighs 9.4 kgs. That is a large difference in weight between those two motors. The Cromotor weighs 12 kg.

I'll know soon how the Cromotor and MXUS compare and if the 2.5kg of less weight in the rear makes any difference, because I can swap between both motors easily and keep all other specs the same. Too bad its freezing here in New York right now.
 
Took the bike out for a very short ride tonight, temps are 18F and my fingers freeze.

Since I have not ridden my bike for over a month it is hard to make a comparison. I believe the Cromotor may be a little more powerful.

From the start it feels as powerful as the cromotor, but mid to upper range I believe the cromotor may be a little more powerful. But this is very preliminary because my charge voltage was only 72 volts instead of 80 volts. I am going to have to do more testing.

I also left all settings the same and only did an auto-detect with my max-e. I'm not sure if I need to change other settings like the PWR to make a better comparison.
 
Offroader said:
Does anyone know the max safe temp I can bring my MXUS 3000 Turbo without damage to the magnets?

Merlin, it seems you think the QS205 is way more powerful than the MXUS Turbo. You may be correct. However, I heard someone else comparing the Cromotor to the MXUS turbo and he said they are close in performance. It may be possible that the QS205 is a lot more powerful than the cromotor. The Cromotor supposedly has a 48mm wide stator vs the MXUS at 45 mm Stator.



You are comparing the QS205 which weighs 12.8kg vs MXUS turbo which weighs 9.4 kgs. That is a large difference in weight between those two motors. The Cromotor weighs 12 kg.

I'll know soon how the Cromotor and MXUS compare and if the 2.5kg of less weight in the rear makes any difference, because I can swap between both motors easily and keep all other specs the same. Too bad its freezing here in New York right now.

So my MAX E default Temp roll back was set at 345F from manufacture, and this was before I had things dialed, I hit that thermo roll back once. Didn't seem to hurt the motor, but I turned things down to 290F. Its possible that temp reading weren't precise though. When I hit 345F, I touched the side of my motor and it wasn't that hot. I have had motors so hot I couldn't touch them for more than an instant or my finger would blister. I posted a pic back of my 5404 getting so hot the stator darkened. This has not happened to my MXUS V2 4T. For what its worth.
 
When comparing different motors in view of the time before overheating, you guys should not forget that more mass means longer time (in quite a linear realation).
 
Just a quick update. I took out the bike again today and did some more riding. Not much because it is freezing. I noticed that my top speed wasn't getting as high as my cromotor and mid to high speed seemed slow, so I decided to adjust the PWR from 1.22 to 1.58. This gave it much more power and gave me my top speed back.

After this adjustment, the MXUS 3000 Turbo seems to be very close to performance to my Cromotor. What seems odd is the MXUS seems to have more torque when climbing stuff and maybe when first hitting the throttle. I even had to release the throttle over some grassy hills because I didn't want to rip up the grass when climbing.

I have a very steep small hill that I like to test my bikes power on and it seems the MXUS pulls up it much faster and easier than my cromotor.

Just doesn't make any sense and I will probably need to put the Cromotor back on. There is a possibility that maybe I weakened the magnets on my cromotor because I once overheated it enough to have to reglue the magnets. However, I don't think I actually weakened them much as I never noticed any power loss.

Does anyone know if I just gave my MXUS more power by increasing the PWR and I am basically cheating when comparing it to the cromotor with a lower PWR? It seems that because I was not able to hit top speed as easily this needed to be adjusted on the MXUS higher than the cromotor. I believe the PWR may have to be adjusted differently on different motors.

I think there is a possibility here that the MXUS turbo may just be close in performance to the Cromotor, we are talking a 45 mm vs 48 mm stator, and the MXUS has the curved magnets.

Either way the MXUS Turbo is a very power motor and should be more than enough power for most people. Plus it looks much better and weighs 5-6lbs less.
 
Interesting watching people compare power not torque density.

The 45mm mxus really shouldn't be compared to a 50mm motor with higher copper fill. Or a 35mm leaf motor.

They are all seperate beasts on a spectrum.

You choose the size that suits the bike. Not everyone wants a hummer. Not everyone wants a subaru WRC impreza.

Bigger isnt always best.


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Samd said:
Interesting watching people compare power not torque density.

The 45mm mxus really shouldn't be compared to a 50mm motor with higher copper fill. Or a 35mm leaf motor.

They are all seperate beasts on a spectrum.

You choose the size that suits the bike. Not everyone wants a hummer. Not everyone wants a subaru WRC impreza.

Bigger isnt always best.


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THE TRUTH Sam. Like comparing apples to watermelons to lemons. Light weight DD, its hard to beat the leaf and H Series, mid weight options, the MXUS and TC40 series are the flavor of the day. Heavy weights, QS205, Cromotor, the 54xx are the biggens. I know, there are only a few pounds that separate each step up, and there in lies the issue, weight vs thrust output. Can't have it all. I know a MXUS with FF will take the same current as a non vented Cromotor, but then add FF to a the Cro or 205 and then those motors can handle way more. Where does on draw the line in the sand?
 
Samd said:
Interesting watching people compare power not torque density.

T

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Could you explain what you mean by comparing power not torque density?

The Cromotor and the MXUS are not too much different, we are talking 48mm vs 45 mm stator and the cromotor v3 doesn't have extra copper fill or curved magnets. Why could you not compare them?
 
Interesting statement. Torque Density. I do not have a clear memory on that, but I do remember reading it somewhere. I think it has to do with Amps per ?????????

I dont know if curved magnets help anything. Need to send 2 of the same motors away to Justin I guess, get them on the Motor Simulator.
 
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