new eZip motor

[latecurtis]

I checked out the new law going in effect DA. posted. It is raining. All 9 SLAs are charged. The old ones have been desulfating all night. Topping all of them off with the three stage three at a time.

Seems like the state is going to agree with the federal law. That makes the new 20" build legal if I wear a helmet because a 48V1killowatt motor is only 750W@36V. That is something a cop would understand if I had to explain. The Schwinn with 44.4V of LIPO would be most difficult to explain though.

Also most cops would rather take the Schwinn anyway as it is a rare Clear Creek and worth at least $500 or more anywhere. The Mongoose however is worth mabye half as much or less and looks custom but a little rough compared to the Schwinn. Also too small of a bike for most people to be interested in.

It makes sense for me to build the Roadmaster now with the little dual motors. All I need is another 36V controller and wire them is series for 18V and 210W each for 17mph. The trick though is hooking up brakes on a 26" frame with 20" wheels. Thanks. Please post when you can.

LC. out.

 

[DrkAngel]

Leave 26" wheel and brakes on front!
Add big fat tire to 20" in back and run rear motors without freewheel so motor acts as a semi-brake when throttle released. - no rear brake!

 

[latecurtis]

Thinking along those lines. Looking for a 24" mountain bike for parts. 24" forks with shocks and front wheel should fit. It would look better and serve the same purpose. Will hook up the motors first though. The electric city bike club moved. I need to find out where they are now.

Dont have a 26" wheel for it anyway. Doug got it on a trade for the new chrome shocks and forks on the Dimond Back. Will be cheaper to pick up a used 24" bike with good brakes on the front than ordering a geared hub motor for the DB. probably $30 for the bike. Not sure about a wide back 20" wheel though. Could cost a lot. hoping I could make the wheel thats on there now with the 80 tooth work. All it needs is a new tube. I will need hardware and am not going to the Home Depot today as it is already dark and raining.

Has anybody converted a regular bike like that to a recumbent? I wish there was a way to hook a pedal sprocket up to the front wheel and get one of those big long comfortable seats. It would require welding I am sure. I dont know how much it would cost but imagine if it were done with the dual motors it would be worth quite a lot with a good paint job and could be sold for a profit. Those 24V 280W motors are very common in kids scooters. I know a guy that has a little scooter with one for 10 or 15 bucks. Also there cheap brand new. Please let me know. Thanks for posting.

LC. out.

 

[latecurtis]

Guess i dont have to spend 20 or 30 bucks. A 24" Huffy. Found on the middle of the sidewalk as I was walking to Wall-Mart as it was raining and I needed exercise anyway. Nobody was around and the chain was off. The brakes are good but handelbars very loose. Just checked the rims and the front is a little bent but can be straightened. The back is a lost cause so it has all the parts I need. 24" forks with brakes and a front wheel. I picked up a tube for the 20" wheel in the back of the Roadmaster.

$10 hardware.

$5 - 20" tube.

$18 - 36V controller.

$20 labor for Doug.

$10 #24' chain.

total $63

How is that for a budjet build. I can use the twist throttle that came with that defective variable controller.
Should be done by next month. Got to order the chain and controller. Everything else should be done before that though. Thanks

LC. out.

 

[latecurtis]

 

[latecurtis]

 

[latecurtis]

http://www.amazon.com/AmpFlow-E30-400-Brushed-Electric-Motor/dp/B00AG21Q64/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1450415217&sr=8-3&keywords=AmpFlow


Price: $119.01 & FREE Shipping.

Brand Name
AmpFlow

Part Number
E30-400

UPC
837654547731

Cable Length
17 inches

EAN
0837654547731

Housing Diameter
3.06 inches

Maximum Input Voltage
36 Volts

Maximum Power
1580 Watts

Minimum Input Voltage
12 Volts

Number of Items
1

 

[latecurtis]

#25 chain is not strong enough. Need to go with #415 chain like the red Mongoose and the unite motor.

With an 11 tooth sprocket for the chain it wil require a 120 tooth sprocket for 37mph according to calculater on page 71. Let me go double check.

yup. basically comes out to 11 * 11 = 121. Where am I going to find anything that big. that is for a 24" wheel not a 20".

If I put 24.5" in for the wheel which I believe is more accurate for 38mph a 110 tooth spoke sprocket will work. I will take a lightweight aluminim one please. Black if you can but will paint. Oh by the way, where do I order. Please post a link if you can. I will work on finding a new 24" 36 spoke wheel. Thanks.

LC. out.

 

[Skalabala]

#25 chain is not strong enough. Need to go with #415 chain like the red Mongoose and the unite motor.

With an 11 tooth sprocket for the chain it wil require a 120 tooth sprocket for 37mph according to calculater on page 71. Let me go double check.

yup. basically comes out to 11 * 11 = 121. Where am I going to find anything that big. that is for a 24" wheel not a 20".

If I put 24.5" in for the wheel which I believe is more accurate for 38mph a 110 tooth spoke sprocket will work. I will take a lightweight aluminim one please. Black if you can but will paint. Oh by the way, where do I order. Please post a link if you can. I will work on finding a new 24" 36 spoke wheel. Thanks.

LC. out.

I would rather go with #35 more teeth on same diameter

 

[latecurtis]

will I find a motor and spoke sprocket for #35 ??

It is a gear reduction issue. Need about 100 tooth minimum for the spoke sprocket. 120 tooth is max and 110 tooth perfect. If a 9 tooth motor sprocket is possible then the wheel sprocket may drop to 90 to 100 tooth.

That is the issue I am looking at.

 

[DrkAngel]

Keep in mind ...
Watch pedal, foot-leg and pant leg-heel clearance on chain-sprocket.
Shorter length motor might be better.

 

[latecurtis]

Motor is behind the seat below the rear brakes. Should clear the brakes also. Problem if finding a wheel sprocket. A #25 - 80 tooth sprocket is smaller than the 57 tooth #415 wheel sprocket. Since a 110 tooth #415 sprocket would be about 18" in diameter I will need something in between the two sizes #25 and #415. That way the wheel sprocket will be about 12 to 14" instead of 18" or larger.

http://www.electricscooterparts.com/sprockets35chain.html

This is a 10 tooth #35. Not sure how it compares to #25 but imagine it to be too small. Not sure. If anyone has any ideas on what I am looking for and who makes it it would be great. A 10 to 1 gear reduction is required so a 10 tooth motor sprocket will need a 100 tooth spoke sprocket. Dont even know where to look. Please let me know. Any links will be appreciated. Thanks.

LC. out.

 

[DrkAngel]

Well 1st ...
Figure out what sprockets are available for your motors.

 

[latecurtis]

US $1,165.95

Is that price right. It is a $50 motor?

I just went to sprocket calculater on page 71.

4900 rpm

20" wheel

56mph

57.2 tooth sprocket.

The 4.5hp motor is more expensive but will work better with 11 tooth motor and 56T spoke sprockets.

Unfortunatlly I dont want to spend that much money right now so I guess I will have to stick with the original little dual motor idea for now unless I see a killer deal on something good for the 11T/56T #415 chain. I will be looking. Thanks.

LC. out.

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=69803

It's funny as I have gone to the Astroflight site multiple times now and found the 15 killowatt version of this motor but dont see this one. I still think two of these, one for the front and one for the back could beat LVPs Death bike.

Also I have searched many times for a zero FX motor and always get the motorcycle but no option for ordering the motor seperate so I can install it on a bycycle. It is trulley frustrating.

I wonder what a cop would do at 75mph on the thruway if a 24" mountain bike went past him doing about 140mph

 

[DAND214]

LC wrote:
I wonder what a cop would do at 75mph on the thruway if a 24" mountain bike went past him doing about 140mph

Call an Ambulance to pick up the pieces :lol:

Dan

 

[latecurtis]

As the Hub Motor Turns and the Lipo Fire Burns. Merry Christmas.


Just got the best Christmas present ever. I got to talk to my son after about six years.

Going to take the Huffy and the Roadmaster over to Dougs and get working on it. Putting the forks,front brakes and pedal crank from the Huffy to the Roadmaster. It will be ready for the little motors and chain then. Mabye later on is the summer I will get the 4.5 horse AmpFlow motor not sure. thanks.

LC. out.

 

[latecurtis]

 

[latecurtis]

As the Hub Motor Turns and the Lipo Fire Burns. 37mph!!

Only need a 90 tooth sprocket for 37mph with the 2.1hp motor. 18" wheel

this one has to hit the top 10 in hairbrain schemes I have come up with. What saftey rating do you give :lol: from one to 10 at 37mph with this bike? I think one of the brakes work a little :lol:

 

[latecurtis]

View attachment 1

 

[latecurtis]

tf8 or 8mm chain offers 10 tooth motor sprockets and 72 tooth wheel sprockets but they mount on the freewheel. I think it is a good choice in chain size up to 2HP instead of #415 motorcycle chain but I really need a 90 tooth for a 20" wheel and a 110 tooth for a 24" wheel. Only the 18" wheel will work and it will still be overgeared at about 44mph according to calculater.

tnc scooters and electric scooter parts both carry those sprockets however I dont see any spoke sprockets that use tf8 chain. It looks like what I am looking for dont exist. I cant even find the old links for the spoke sprocket I ordered. Please post a link.

Searched DAs toolbox and google as well as yahoo. Spoke sprockets are rare animals.

•Maximum power: 1580 Watts, (2.1 horsepower); Maximum stall torque: 11 Nm, (1500 oz-in.)
•Peak efficiency at 24V: 79% at 29 Amps and 5100 RPM
•Power and torque at peak efficiency: 560 Watts, (0.75 horsepower), and 1030 mNm, (145 oz-in.)

going to recalculate at 5100 RPM

still dont work because 560W is only good for about 22mph not 35. there is no good solution for this only thing to do is try it with the 10 tooth motor and 72 tooth wheel sprockets. Dont even know what type of motor sprocket goes on the AmpFlow either. I give up. Anybody got any answers as the 2.1HP motor on the 18" Razor bike is a last resort. I wanted it for the 24" bike as it has better brakes.

Found the e bay link on page 82 posted multiple times but nothing over 60 tooth and #415. Too bad as the 2.1 and 4.5HP motors are not only lighter than a Unite motor 1/2 of their output rating but they can fit in smaller places than a Unite motor as the diameter is a little over 3 inches making rear mount behind the seat possible in many more situtations. Dont know why the rpms are not lower to make the applications possible without expensive and awkward gear reduction though. It makes no sense.

I am going back to that Hobby King RC motor post now to see if one of those motors will be a better choice. I remember being told that the way their desighned I should gear them for about half of their rated power though. I do retain knowledge. That is part of being intellegent is to remember what you research. If a Hobby king RC motor is used for an e bike instead of a lightweight plane or drone than 2,000W of RC power = 1.000W e bike power so gear accordingly.

It was not worded exactly like that though but that is what I got out of the research I did on those type of motors. I think my son said he was going to college for science. That makes sense as since a small child I have been totally facinated with science and technology. I am going to go to Hobby King now to calculate KV. The lower the better as KV * V = rpm. Got to love technology.

No go at HK. Google 130KV = 355.92 US Dollar for

http://alienpowersystem.com/shop/brushless-motors/12090-outrunner-brushless-motor-130kv-15000w/

Running at 36V = 7.5 killowatts it should be geared for 3.75 killowatts or the same as a 4.5HP AmpFlow motor or no more than 50mph. That will work for the 24" Huffy with 24" wheels and both front and rear brakes.

For the 26" Roadmaster with 20" wheels we will go with the 7killowatt version.

http://alienpowersystem.com/shop/brushless-motors/c80100-outrunner-brushless-motor-130kv-7000w/


for the 15 killowatt motor.

4.1 * 8 = 32.8V * 130KV = 4264rpm

rpm = 4264

tire = 24.5"

speed = 50mph

#415 motor sprocket = 11T

#415 spoke sprocket = 68 tooth

For the 7 killowatt motor. - 159.34 US Dollar

The 10 tooth 8mm motor sprocket and 72 tooth 8mm wheel sprocket = 35mph at 32.8V - 4s Lipo.

If anyone disagrees with this research please notify me. I see these brushless 130KV motors to be a better option than AmpFlow for at least two builds and possibly three if I build the 18" Razor for 25mph with a 3 killowatt 130KV motor.
I also remember someone mentioning that low end performance is poor in these types of motors.

Since I have seen people get flipped over backwards and almost knocked out mabye a little less power at take off could be a positive thing. That and the 50% gearing according to power output should make the bikes built with these motors fully functional and long lasting plus good hill climbers.

Please respond or post when you can. I want to know who agrees with me and who does not and why. I got to look at controller options. Hobby King seems to have the batteries covered with their LIPO deals but I know little about their controllers and prices. Thanks. Please post when you can.

LC. out.

PS. I see DA. and Sunders name at the bottom. I know you guys are there. Please post I am going to Hobby King Now .

 

[DrkAngel]

As a basic factor ...
Large diameter motors produce high torque at low rpm,
vs
Small diameter motors produce low torque at high rpm.

 

[latecurtis]

good for high speed but wont break your neck at take off correct? Like a gas motor makes more horsepower at higher rpm and peak torque is at lower rpm. The big block makes more torque at low rpm but since the small block winds quicker it is a tradeoff. The big block needs lower gearing than the small block in the 1320 shuffle. Remember I am a motorhead from the early 80s.

To beat LFP I will need the best of both worlds. A huge brushed 20lb motor on the back for the 1/8 mile and a high rpm brushless motor less than 5 pounds to get the job done.

HK has lots but not sure what I need. Alien Power Systems not queing. Will try tommorow. So far the motor and LIPO prices are a green light. I just need cheap controller options and I am good. Thanks.

LC. out.

 

[DrkAngel]

LC ...
You are frustrating ... verging on the infuriating ... to many people ...

You "need" a basic reliable eBike and "want" a high speed-power eBike.
Sadly, although you have several, you seem to try to make every one accomplish both, and seem to fail at either ...
Gearing for high speed gives you pitiful, inefficient and damaging low to normal speed performance!

Try to accomplish both, but segregate into 2 separate builds!
Then you can have a reasonable expectation of accomplishing both.

1. Hub or gear reduction motor for maximum 20mph "legal" transport - cargo needs.
Should provide years of reliable service.

2. Some form of RC motor and high output RC Lipo for high speed - high torque experiments
Should allow a few "suicide runs".
Either you will finally realize the true nature of power and garner a bit of respect >> fear ...
or your choice of components will highlight the folly of your methods in a exacting >> fatalistic manner.

 

[latecurtis]

You have a way with words bro. But you said it like it is. I got two cargo bikes now and am looking for a couple of suicide experminets to do. :lol: :lol: :lol: . Maby I should put my crash helmet on when I try it.

 

[DrkAngel]

You have a way with words bro. But you said it like it is. I got two cargo bikes now and am looking for a couple of suicide experminets to do. :lol: :lol: :lol: . Maby I should put my crash helmet on when I try it.

Your cargo bikes are geared-volted too high for optimal cargo bike use!