Surly Pugsley: E-bike possible? Or just crazy?

[snajczuk]

Hello to all.

Been browsing the sphere for about 4 hours, but I was bitten by the ebike bug weeks ago. I have two bikes in my quiver right now, a classy surly cross check with wooden fenders, canvas bag, brooks saddle, custom paint, my favorite bike by far, but it's staying human powered. I also have an old schwinn that I custom painted myself and converted to fixed gear, and I love that one too. So in my search for a third to "round things out" (if that's possible) I have decided on either a Puglsey or an ebike (old trek 820, maybe with an xtracycle). But then tonight, I thought to myself, "could I have both in the same bike?"

Am I crazy for even thinking this? Are 4 inch tires and a hub motor totally nutzo? Now I know that it will have more rolling resistance than anything else out there (okay, a lot more) so I get that I won't be joining any 40 mph club anytime soon. But isn't it reasonable to think that with a 9C or Clyte motor I could do 25 mph easy? I'm basically thinking out loud, but before I get myself into anything too seriously $$$-wise, I thought I'd bounce the idea off the ebike crazies here.

I envision this as a kind of fooling around, do anything even when I don't want to pedal bike. With a BOB trailer, I now have an SUV/Humvee replacement.

For those of you not familiar with this beast, some of the quirks include a front fork spaced wide enough to use 135mm rear hubs, and a rear wheel build that requires dishing in the opposite direction in order to maintain a reasonable chainline. Other than this, I can't see any differences between this and any other all steel mountain bike frame that would be compatible with an ebike kit. I know that the rear wheel is what would make or break this project, so that's what I'd like to focus on initially. It would mean I couldn't just order a kit with the wheel already built, but that doesn't seem like such a bad thing if I can teach myself to build a really complex wheel with a motor for the hub. (I'm rambling...)

What do you think? I'm secretly hoping that no one has done this before, but if it's been done, please point me to whomever has failed/succeeded in the process.

 

[beast775]

will definately stop any thoughts of full suspension those tires and rims,the rolling resistance trade will equal everything out.ow ya welcome to es.

 

[LI-ghtcycle]

Sounds like a great idea!

You could get one monster of a hub motor in there, I'd use one of the big X-Lights that all the land speed record guys are using on their E-Bikes, doesn't mean you have to run it that fast, but on such a monster wheel, it would be a shame not to go big!

I think there is even a super hub motor designed for like 3k watts or so, Golden Motor makes it IIRC.

 

[sjacome]

it would be awesome

maybe a puma hub motor and lipo rc packs hould be fun, i dont know, u r at ur risk.

Check that its a big rear tire and the rim profile is assimetric to allow chain clearance. Ceck for "surly endomorf tire" and "large marge rim" on google,etc


check other fat tires bikes

 

[grwsaltspring]

Have you looked at the new Salsa Mukluk? I'd been thinking along the same lines recently, so I'm intrigued to see what, if anything, you get up to. Keep us posted.

 

[snajczuk]

Have you looked at the new Salsa Mukluk? I'd been thinking along the same lines recently, so I'm intrigued to see what, if anything, you get up to. Keep us posted.

Hadn't checked out the mukluk. Looks interesting. The new pugsley just arrived on the scene according to surly's website, disc brakes only, which is cool. Also found out that there was a pugsley build on here a while back. There's a website about the build, but I've misplaced the link and it was all in French anyhow. I'm just using this as a think out loud thread for right now, but maybe in a month or so this could take off.

Two things have me concerned right now: first, I won't get to experience these huge tires before I have the bike built because there are no LBS's around here that would even dream of carrying the pugsley, and i don't know of anyone who owns one, so a test ride is out of the question. Second, at 25-30 mph, what are these tires going to do? That's a lot of rubber spinning around, and they seem to be designed for low and slow. I want to be able to go off road, and I have no question they can handle that, but can they handle pavement for 3-6 miles a day at those speeds? What's the lifespan of a tire under those conditions?

I may at this point be leaning towards having two sets of wheels around for this bike: hub powered 2.35" big apples, and pedal powered large marge/endomorphs for switchouts depending on what the ride will look like. But someone talk me out of that if it seems weird.

OR, maybe I could just put big apples on the large marge rims if the endos don't cut it with the motor on. We'll see. I have to get my head around this ebike stuff some more before I embark on this quest.

 

[auraslip]

The problem with large wheels is a) the endomorph has horrible rolling resistance. b) other large tires are for hobbyist "cruiser" bikes. I would not trust them as a daily rider, let alone a 30 mph ebike.

As a whole I think the community could do a lot of good by investigating D.O.T. approved motorcycle tires. They are rated for high speeds, and the temperatures that come with those speeds. On the other hand hookworms and Cyclops work great for under 2.5"


I was very interested in the pugsley for JUST this reason

Also I e-mailed surly about tire clearance on the big dummy. Apparently if you run a 24" tire you can fit a 3.4" tire in the rear.

 

[Evoforce]

I think it looks like a great e-bike plus a thudbuster! Maybe a 50 mph plus bike.

 

[dogman dan]

I can't see any reason why a 5304 clyte or 9c motor spoked into a large marge rim on a pugsley wouldn't be anything less than dreamy. Go for it.

Holmes hobbies is the guy to get your rim laced with a motor.

 

[Green Machine]

I just ordered a pugsley and illia at ebikes sf is going to convert it to either a single or dual motor bmc 600 watt...

What do you think of the bmc's on the surley?

 

[MadRhino]

Big wheels are screaming for a Clyte. I'd go for a 5305 and a 72v controller. Gears and clutch would have a hard time, especially if you ride the beast in lose dirt.

 

[RallySTX]

The very idea sets my mouth watering. I would start with a minimum of 48 volts of LIPO, and a rear X5 or 9C hub laced by JRH, and a Lyen controller. Just keep those tires hard, unless offroad, and remember that all that rotating mass will slow down the handling. Disk brakes front and back would be mandatory. I hope your roads are smooth, or you may wish for a full suspension bike. Beware of aquaplane! Keep an eye on hubmotor temp. Double the expected amp hours needed for range. Keep it out of the ditch, and you'll have one of the coolest bikes arround. I for one would love to see it.
Brian L.