JRP3
🚴♂️ Mega poster
The motor would be on the swing arm, not the controller. I have that setup on my Solar Eclipse.
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VFR400 20kw Build
- Thread starter kagemushablues
- Start date
The motor in this case is located in close proximity to the pendulum axis, that is, the lever for vibrations off-road is very small, but space is freed up for installing a normal battery, and not a small part of it from what is required for a powerful configuration.
kagemushablues
🔌 New-ish
Hey y'all some update. Life came along and this was on hold for a while, and finally back on track.
VFR400E Update after measurements:
- 111v151Ah, 96v-1000A apt con (together 80kg kill me please).
- Modified 10" 17kw hub motor (rotor sprocket mod), cnc 7075 aluminum swingarm drive. *
- 1:1.5 final drive ratio - aiming for quiet, linear accel to 105mph.
- 16"/18" -> 15"/15"-55-190, raised rear just like vfr400; bike is lowered an inch (I'm short).
- Wheelbase extended from 1345mm to 1425mm (still shorter than sv650!).
- Monoshock 300mm, 80mm travel (room for two shocks in case swingarm build is too heavy).
- Charger in lift-up drawer placed in tank (rebuilt, fiberglass).
- 12v and rest of electricals to be shoved... somewhere.
*PLEASE HELP:
- 17kw 10" hub can easily take 80kw phase.
- Hub motor spinning freely on its axel pulling a chain/belt... bad idea? For example:
- During braking, would the momentum of a heavy motor snap the belt/chain? Let's say if doing a powerslide, sharp braking = snap?
Thanks!
thebes
⚡ Regular
Couple things
What cells? What config? Are you actually sure it can fit? Thats almost 17kwh and last time I rode a vfr400 I dont remember the frame being particularly large. You also have to account for reinforcing the frame around the swingarm pivot and the two bits that come down on the sides as although the swingarm is not directly attached to the engine like it is in the later generations, the engine is still a structural component and adds a fair bit of rigidity and torsional strength to the frame. I also would not modify the suspension geometry like you suggested with the image, as that can and will mess the handling up greatly if youre not careful. Also, why are you going with the apt96100? Its not particularly reliable nor user friendly, nor compact, nor particularly cheap (oh I see you already have it :/ )...There are better options depending on what motor you end up going with.
Are you planning to use a hub as a mid drive? Why? It is much simpler to just start with a motor designed for that application in the first place rather than gamble that the side walls of the hub can take a certain amount of torque without shearing or shattering. If you want to use a hub as a hub, go for it, if you want to use an inrunner as an inrunner, go for it, but I wouldnt use the former as a latter.
I would personally leave the swingarm untouched and mount the motor in a more traditional position as there arent really many benefits to the swingarm design but there are a lot of drawbacks :/
Not sure what you mean 17kw and 80kw phase. The highest power hubs right now are most likely going to come from qs in the form of the qs268. Though, again, it would be better if you go with something like a zf75-10 or an emrax 188, or a magelec m19p5s19, or something similar if you are looking for a real 80kw output.
You wouldnt really have any issues with that as a normal ice engine has more rotational mass than even the largest hubs do now. A 530 chain can take something like ~150kw and a ~10k nm of torque pretty conservatively so it should be more than fine.
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My 10kW QS273 60 H Hub Motor takes easily 30kW from the battery and 1400A phase current. 40kW for acceleration would shure be no problem, but my BMS can´t cope.
Before I had a QS260 40H which was fed with 20kW and 650A phase current, that was in my usecase absolute maximum.
In summer the controller had to reduce power very often, because winding temps rechead 140C.
Almost certainly yes. With the current availability of motors, just buy a regular mid-drive motor. Also, do not mount it on the swingarm if you can help it. Mounting on the swingarm is very suboptimal because it increases unsprung mass, which is very nontrivial with a motor that can take 80kW. If you want that much power for speed, it will need to be a big one, likely watercooled, and i don't see space for water cooling either. You can likely save some space by getting rid of the charger which isn't strictly necessary to be built into the bike. If it's aircooled, you'll likely need the largest motor you'll be able to fit, but that will require major design modifications from what you've shown. Good luck!
This idea has some insoluble contradictions: a powerful motor (80 kW) would require a large-capacity battery, which there's no room for.
Therefore, I'd scale back the ambitions a bit
.The design above claimed "111v151Ah" from an "80kg" battery. Assuming that's actually possible (big "if" in itself), should leave plenty of wiggle room.
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