bzhwindtalker
100 kW
[youtube]SXdnWRXgNG0[/youtube]
LMX P2 : Freeride trials motorcycle frame development
- Thread starter bzhwindtalker
- Start date
John in CR
100 TW
Hey Adam. I tried going to simply LMXbikes.com and got a 404 message. I think it's a setting with your DNS provider that's required to enable proper routing with or without the www. in front.
bzhwindtalker
100 kW
I will look into that john, we use google apps for the website.
The higher kv motor seems to heat quite a but less but we'll now for sure soon with better battery. Lucas will set up a 2.2 for him too with the 16 poles motors coming in the mail so well know the difference between the 8 pole 70kv I have and the new 16pole 70kv.
Adam
The higher kv motor seems to heat quite a but less but we'll now for sure soon with better battery. Lucas will set up a 2.2 for him too with the 16 poles motors coming in the mail so well know the difference between the 8 pole 70kv I have and the new 16pole 70kv.
Adam
Finally, I've recieved the frame last week! Looks nice and feels like a rock. Still waiting for the rear hub to get it rolling.
Biggest problem so far is the length of the steering tube. It's 140mm long and Marzocchi 888 will fit headset with max 24mm stack height without bottom crown hitting the stance seals hard.
I have tough Pig DH Pro with 31mm stack height and it wont fit even with the Hope integrated top crown. Good quality tough headsets with cartridge sealed bearings and <25mm stack are virtually non existent.
I've only found two 24mm that is still produced: FSA Hammer and M-Part In-Line Low Profile . FSA Hammer is a nonsealed/nocartridge crap. And M-part is a half cartrodge half sealed halfcrap.
And even with 24mm stack it is still 4mm more than maximum 160mm crown space as per 888 manual.
I lean towards buying a custom top crown with +15mm drop.
Also I've changed the front motor bearing for a high quality sealed one and currently rebuilding motorshaft to receive different sprockets.
Biggest problem so far is the length of the steering tube. It's 140mm long and Marzocchi 888 will fit headset with max 24mm stack height without bottom crown hitting the stance seals hard.
I have tough Pig DH Pro with 31mm stack height and it wont fit even with the Hope integrated top crown. Good quality tough headsets with cartridge sealed bearings and <25mm stack are virtually non existent.
I've only found two 24mm that is still produced: FSA Hammer and M-Part In-Line Low Profile . FSA Hammer is a nonsealed/nocartridge crap. And M-part is a half cartrodge half sealed halfcrap.
And even with 24mm stack it is still 4mm more than maximum 160mm crown space as per 888 manual.
I lean towards buying a custom top crown with +15mm drop.
I have 10kW KEB and installed thermal sensor right into the windings of the motor to cut it off at >130C. One pitfall with Kelly is that it's 5v output is not so well regulated and temerature measurement can be very inaccurate.RalterWöhrl said:Hi everyone!
1. Motor Heat / lost efficiancy:[/size]
There where a few comments where I red about temperature and lost efficiancy issues with the BHT 48V 1000W motor and the kelly controllers. Did that get sortet out?
Adam recommends the Kelly KBS72121X,55A,24-72V, Mini Brushless DC Controller in his build list, is there anything to take care of before buying these two?
2. Thumb- or Twist-Throttle?[/size]
Is that just personal preference or where are the pros and cons for one or the other on hard ridden free-ride bikes like the LMX?
Coming from an 4wheel/ATV Backround I would definitly like thumb trottle more, however after speaking to a few really good pro MotoX drivers they all were like: "If thumb trottle would give any benefit, why would not anyone riders use it?"
Also I've changed the front motor bearing for a high quality sealed one and currently rebuilding motorshaft to receive different sprockets.
bzhwindtalker said:
do they really have same kV
if they have than the advantage of more poles normally is higher torque per amp (higher kT) and a bit smoother at take off / very low RPM, but if the 16pole motor doesn't have thinner steel lams it will have higher eddy losses what will lead to lower efficiency at higher rpm.
The advantage of lower poles often is more copper fill but what motor will produce the lowest heat at given torque output depends on phase to phase resistance.
do you have a change to measure it? Would be really informative. And also confirm the kV please.
bzhwindtalker
100 kW
Dennis,
You can run sealed cartriges headsets without the top dust cover to gain some clearance, that's what I do on my setup, with a BBB headset.
You can run sealed cartriges headsets without the top dust cover to gain some clearance, that's what I do on my setup, with a BBB headset.
crossbreak
1 MW
madin88 said:
We are in touch to achieve that soon. I agree that Ri should be lower in trade of higher no load loss
Adam, thanks for the tip. I've been thinking of that too, but it will save only a couple mm and the top bearing will be exposed to water and mud. But no big problem, I've already bought custom 888 top crown, so I can fit almost any good headset up to 35mm stack.bzhwindtalker said:
I've looked into Fox 40 and it has 7mm more total stack height than Marzocchi 888, up to about 27mm headset stack unmodified.
DasDouble
100 kW
New video out :O
Finally recieved the rear hub!
The hub bearings are jamming like hell, both when the hub is installed or not
The inner spacer sides are both beaten up.
Also the hub width with provided spacers is 140mm, but the frame dropuots are only 130mm.
UPD
Well, I pressed one bearing out. Both are not silk smooth, but OK.
Pressed it back. It is better now, when tightened, but still not good.
The hub bearings are jamming like hell, both when the hub is installed or not
The inner spacer sides are both beaten up.
Also the hub width with provided spacers is 140mm, but the frame dropuots are only 130mm.
UPD
Well, I pressed one bearing out. Both are not silk smooth, but OK.
Pressed it back. It is better now, when tightened, but still not good.
Attachments
bzhwindtalker
100 kW
Hello Denis,
The frame should be 140mm, and the hub and spacers too.
The sprocket side spacer should be 25mm and the disk side spacer 15mm.
Can you check that? as I used this frame before with one of our hubs, it should be 135 or 140mm but we did not make any 130mm dropout frame.
About the bearings yes those are really no the best bearings we had better bearings on orders but they just arrived now, sorry about that..
We press-fit the bearings, installation should not have caused bearing damage.
I will do what I can to find a solution for you!
Adam
The frame should be 140mm, and the hub and spacers too.
The sprocket side spacer should be 25mm and the disk side spacer 15mm.
Can you check that? as I used this frame before with one of our hubs, it should be 135 or 140mm but we did not make any 130mm dropout frame.
About the bearings yes those are really no the best bearings we had better bearings on orders but they just arrived now, sorry about that..
We press-fit the bearings, installation should not have caused bearing damage.
I will do what I can to find a solution for you!
Adam
querlenker
1 W
Adam, do you know this? http://e-nolix.com ???
DasDouble
100 kW
Holy moterfuxing cow... Two options:querlenker said:
1.) This guys just bought the frame from LMX and copyed it
2.) They buyed the frame but say that it is their own one
3.) They are a seller of the LMX bike frame and LMX is ok with them.
The frame is *exactly*, 100% the same frame like from lmx. You can´t see any difference!
bzhwindtalker
100 kW
I sold Christian a frame in december 2014, this is the frame I sold him in the video. He never talked about getting more frames from me.
Edit : looked trough emails, Christian actually asked to buy more frames, last email from him on Aug 6
Edit : looked trough emails, Christian actually asked to buy more frames, last email from him on Aug 6
DasDouble
100 kW
So it isn´t actuallybzhwindtalker said:
right that the sells your frame... is it?
scorpionice
10 W
BZH can I use a small block motor on your frame like lightning rods now that you have that motor mount already?
I've got some good SKF bearings, so it's not a problem. Supplied bearings start to rub even under small axial load.bzhwindtalker said:
Pivot bearings are OK, but I think they are overpressed, as they do not rotate freely even when pivot axle is tightened.
I'll make a rig to bend the rear arm slightly to 140mm dropuot width. It is not possible now to install anything wider than 135mm single-handedly. Rear arm is very rigid, which is good, until you want to bend it accurately and intentionally.
I know the last batch of frames was built for you by toloka aka petriot in UA, they even posted photos of it on the russian ebike forum in april.
They made dozen a frames (not LMX) for our locals. Typically the same issues like mine, but on a bigger scale.
Main issues are wrong dropout width and painted/too big bearing seats. Better check every frame before shipping.
I have some suggestions about better parts supply:
1. Instead of generic bolts for hub/pivot axles use proper shafts. 150mm hub shaft fits good for pivot.
Bolts are typically have huge -0.2-0.25mm clearence with an inner bearing ring. A proper shaft is around -0.05mm and much better quality.
2. Use RSH SKF bearings instead of generic RS ones. RSH's are much better protected against water and designed to withstand high-pressure cleaning.
3. Supply all the correct bolts needed to mount rear shock/frame parts. It can be pain in the ass time consuming to search for one missing bolt.
Attachments
bzhwindtalker
100 kW
Thanks for your suggestions Denis, Of course ideally we would do everyting in house but it is not possible at the moment.
About the axles, we asked for custom axles with 11.85+-0.1 tolerence but we got bolts, that where 10mm too long and that we had to cut and re-treat for corrosion protection.
For the bearings, we used the same generic ones for now 2 years on a 10kw+ 50kg prototype without any issues. We get them there, you can check price : http://www.123roulement.com/roulement-6001-2RS.php
I agree that the ones we installed on your hub (cheaper ones) were quite bad, we have 8 more of those that will go to the trash. I can offer you a partial refund for the price of the SKF bearings and your time.
Do you think the swingarm has been damaged during transport? as I was using this frame before with the same hub I can only think of that option
About the non-lmx frames, can you please send me some pictures or link? thanks!
About the axles, we asked for custom axles with 11.85+-0.1 tolerence but we got bolts, that where 10mm too long and that we had to cut and re-treat for corrosion protection.
For the bearings, we used the same generic ones for now 2 years on a 10kw+ 50kg prototype without any issues. We get them there, you can check price : http://www.123roulement.com/roulement-6001-2RS.php
I agree that the ones we installed on your hub (cheaper ones) were quite bad, we have 8 more of those that will go to the trash. I can offer you a partial refund for the price of the SKF bearings and your time.
Do you think the swingarm has been damaged during transport? as I was using this frame before with the same hub I can only think of that option
About the non-lmx frames, can you please send me some pictures or link? thanks!
macribs
10 MW
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2014
- Messages
- 3,702
Here are the link for the LMX clone:
http://e-nolix.com/product
http://e-nolix.com/about-us
The way they present the product it seems they are working real hard to make visitors believe they have come up with the idea, the design and the manufacturing.
Don't know if you OK'd this or not, if not you might wanna lawyer up.
http://e-nolix.com/product
http://e-nolix.com/about-us
The way they present the product it seems they are working real hard to make visitors believe they have come up with the idea, the design and the manufacturing.
Don't know if you OK'd this or not, if not you might wanna lawyer up.
Samd
10 MW
Man thats pretty rude of them. I guess they may have intention of purchasing adam's frame but it'd seem rude not to understand this up front.
DasDouble
100 kW
Oh man I would lawyer up against them right now. At least it was YOUR idea and not the idea of them. What a couple of ass****s...
Go and hunt them down!
Go and hunt them down!
motomoto
1 kW
- Joined
- Jun 28, 2010
- Messages
- 458
Those German guys suck so badly. They just copied Adam's design exactly. No imagination at all and the one guy claims to be an engineer.
I have watched Adam's evolution of design and am very impressed and after years of development he finally reached a superior design only to
have someone steal it. Wow.
I have watched Adam's evolution of design and am very impressed and after years of development he finally reached a superior design only to
have someone steal it. Wow.
You might be able turn this into a positive if he wants to use your frames. I would try to contact and arrange a deal, he seems good with the marketing side of things.
But it does look like a dick move, no credit for parts, "prototype" makes it seem its a one off.
Its great to see passion and wanting to share the fun but he is going the wrong way about it.
But it does look like a dick move, no credit for parts, "prototype" makes it seem its a one off.
Its great to see passion and wanting to share the fun but he is going the wrong way about it.
