grindz145
1 MW
I'm amazed that you did all of that and pretty much stayed on your budget. WOW 
Mobile fab shop power???
- Thread starter mdd0127
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mdd0127
100 kW
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Quick update!
The inverter is garbage and so far, dcacpower has pulled a nice hobbyking on me. I thought the inverter was working in November but I've been having things blow up. The cnc controller for the mill got fried, two computer power supplies, one mother board, one hard drive, and finally some fluorescent light ballasts. Every time something blew up, I tested the inverter output and it was fine so I wrote it off to shoddy equipment and maybe cold temps. After the light ballasts blew, I checked it and is was pumping out 1360 volts on two of it's outputs and 50vdc on the other two. So basically I've been fighting an intermittently bunk inverter for the last few months. The guys at dcacpower want me to pay $130 to send it back to Canada for repairs which will take a few weeks and won't budge on sending me a new one or refunding my money. If you guys got a look inside this thing, you'd be livid. I got a new inverter from Sunforce that's MUCH nicer than the other one and am running again. I insulated the whole shop and installed a direct vent propane heater. I also picked up a grizzly G0516 lathe mill combo to round out the tools. The task for today is finishing up the rear wall and door, then it's on to cleaning up and setting up all of the equipment. I have a couple of jobs to do for ES members over the next week and will be officially digging into the bike build full force the week after that. All of this has taken so much more time than I ever would have guessed but most of the delays are due to people selling things that should have never left the factory and then being shady about it. Once I actually get good, working, undamaged supplies in hand, things come together pretty quickly.
The inverter is garbage and so far, dcacpower has pulled a nice hobbyking on me. I thought the inverter was working in November but I've been having things blow up. The cnc controller for the mill got fried, two computer power supplies, one mother board, one hard drive, and finally some fluorescent light ballasts. Every time something blew up, I tested the inverter output and it was fine so I wrote it off to shoddy equipment and maybe cold temps. After the light ballasts blew, I checked it and is was pumping out 1360 volts on two of it's outputs and 50vdc on the other two. So basically I've been fighting an intermittently bunk inverter for the last few months. The guys at dcacpower want me to pay $130 to send it back to Canada for repairs which will take a few weeks and won't budge on sending me a new one or refunding my money. If you guys got a look inside this thing, you'd be livid. I got a new inverter from Sunforce that's MUCH nicer than the other one and am running again. I insulated the whole shop and installed a direct vent propane heater. I also picked up a grizzly G0516 lathe mill combo to round out the tools. The task for today is finishing up the rear wall and door, then it's on to cleaning up and setting up all of the equipment. I have a couple of jobs to do for ES members over the next week and will be officially digging into the bike build full force the week after that. All of this has taken so much more time than I ever would have guessed but most of the delays are due to people selling things that should have never left the factory and then being shady about it. Once I actually get good, working, undamaged supplies in hand, things come together pretty quickly.
vanilla ice
1 MW
You rule! Niiiice. On budget, on point. Doesn't sound like its too much doing to get it mobile either.
Sucks about the inverter, post pics of the internals along with details of the make/model/seller so we can avoid it!
Sucks about the inverter, post pics of the internals along with details of the make/model/seller so we can avoid it!
Based on the info so far, it's probably these guys:
http://www.dcacpower.com/contact_us.html
but Mdd0127 will have to confirm that. (the only other similar one I can find is in North Carolina, so is unlikely to be them).
And yes, pics of the guts and problems would be very good to have attached to the thread.
http://www.dcacpower.com/contact_us.html
but Mdd0127 will have to confirm that. (the only other similar one I can find is in North Carolina, so is unlikely to be them).
And yes, pics of the guts and problems would be very good to have attached to the thread.
mdd0127
100 kW
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I want to give them a chance to make it right but if they don't soon, I'll definitely post up some high res pics of the inside. I'll even post my emails to them. You guys will get some good laughs for sure! I know I can fix the inverter. It's not complicated stuff. I just really don't have the time to spend on it and that's the main issue. I've spent a lot of time already and don't want to get into ordering parts and stuff. I have a bike to build! Even though I've been having issues with dcacpower, I still think they're good guys at heart. They're just trying to cover their butts. I sent them a pretty gnarly email about it and hopefully they respect the truth. If they do, I've promised to keep my public opinions about them to myself. We'll see in a few days I guess.
Now, Sunforce.....makes a very nice inverter. Their 2500 watt version is happily running the shop right now. It pulls less than 36 watts at no load and has handled everything I've needed it to. I'll definitely have to stagger loads but it should do the job until I can get the situation sorted out on the bigger one.
Now, Sunforce.....makes a very nice inverter. Their 2500 watt version is happily running the shop right now. It pulls less than 36 watts at no load and has handled everything I've needed it to. I'll definitely have to stagger loads but it should do the job until I can get the situation sorted out on the bigger one.
mdd0127
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Ok, the bunk inverter supplier is dcacpower.com based out of Quebec. They finally agreed to let me send it back to their US location in NY which would cost me $43 instead of $130 to get it back to Canada. They said their truck would then bring it to them, which could take a few weeks, then they would need it for 5 days to repair it, then they'd send it back. They also tried to get me to upgrade to a bigger inverter that they don't even have yet....at an awesome deal of only a few hundred dollars from me!.....once the Chinese New Year was over in six weeks...... 
The crap I had to go through to get to that point though was absolutely ridiculous. They are total scammers. You guys would die laughing if you heard some of the things they said. Things like, "Sure, I know there's some little chinese kid just tearing through these things over there." And , "Come on now, it's an import......like really....uh...it should....they work and everything.....but.....uh....sometimes they're not the best." And, "We've sold thousands of these and yours is the first defective one." And then, "Look, these are cheap, sometimes they break and we fix them but we can't cover the shipping because we're just a reseller for another business in New Jersey." I could continue but I think you get the drift.
So am I sending it back? I don't think I can justify spending another $43 and waiting who knows how long for who knows what to come back. The thing taking a dump, burning up my other stuff and wasted my time has literally tapped me out. The Sunforce ran the Mill/Lathe Combo tonight so I'm covered for now but still need a backup inverter with more juice. I'm not getting my money back. So I've decided to rebuild it with good parts. It should be less than $43 to order nicer parts. I'll look at it like I paid $650 for a nice heat sink and a few boards and connectors. It should only take me a day or two to get it customized and optimized. It's a low priority though so it might be a few weeks before I get going on it.
If you want to know what was wrong with the inverter, here's a short list: Bad soldering...everywhere. I missed a few joints on my first reflow. Incorrect board design resulting in a haphazard fan control fet mod hovering over the board, legs twisted together, with solder blob extended legs and wires running everywhere. The solder blobs from the fet surgery operation fell onto a couple of the IC's, bridging the legs. A few of the main supply wires and wires on the fan control fet mod are rubbed through from chafing??? strange because the truck hasn't moved since the install. An insulated board mounting clamp overtightened so the insulation failed and burned through to the board. Again, I could go on. When I took it apart the first time, I took the covers off to expose the bottoms of the boards and resoldered what I could see which was apparently not much due to temporary shop lighting and exhaustion. On the more recent inspection, I took it completely apart and used a headlamp to see all of the wonderfulness. I took pics but they degraded to 125k ish when I dumped them from the camera and don't show too much. I'll take new ones before I tear into it next time.
I wish I had the budget to take my own advice all of the time. I could probably bought a few top of the line inverters from a reputable supplier...or built one from scratch... if I accounted for the wasted time and damaged equipment. In the end though, I will end up with a very nice inverter.
The shop is all insulated, heater installed, and almost set completely back up. I plan on getting a few more pics up as soon as I finalize a couple more things inside and scoot everything into it's final position. It's really nice in there and despite the small space should be very productive. I'm really glad that I put it together instead of throwing money away renting a shop and wasting time commuting. Now I have a tool that should last for a really long time and make all kinds of things possible.
The crap I had to go through to get to that point though was absolutely ridiculous. They are total scammers. You guys would die laughing if you heard some of the things they said. Things like, "Sure, I know there's some little chinese kid just tearing through these things over there." And , "Come on now, it's an import......like really....uh...it should....they work and everything.....but.....uh....sometimes they're not the best." And, "We've sold thousands of these and yours is the first defective one." And then, "Look, these are cheap, sometimes they break and we fix them but we can't cover the shipping because we're just a reseller for another business in New Jersey." I could continue but I think you get the drift.So am I sending it back? I don't think I can justify spending another $43 and waiting who knows how long for who knows what to come back. The thing taking a dump, burning up my other stuff and wasted my time has literally tapped me out. The Sunforce ran the Mill/Lathe Combo tonight so I'm covered for now but still need a backup inverter with more juice. I'm not getting my money back. So I've decided to rebuild it with good parts. It should be less than $43 to order nicer parts. I'll look at it like I paid $650 for a nice heat sink and a few boards and connectors. It should only take me a day or two to get it customized and optimized. It's a low priority though so it might be a few weeks before I get going on it.
If you want to know what was wrong with the inverter, here's a short list: Bad soldering...everywhere. I missed a few joints on my first reflow. Incorrect board design resulting in a haphazard fan control fet mod hovering over the board, legs twisted together, with solder blob extended legs and wires running everywhere. The solder blobs from the fet surgery operation fell onto a couple of the IC's, bridging the legs. A few of the main supply wires and wires on the fan control fet mod are rubbed through from chafing??? strange because the truck hasn't moved since the install. An insulated board mounting clamp overtightened so the insulation failed and burned through to the board. Again, I could go on. When I took it apart the first time, I took the covers off to expose the bottoms of the boards and resoldered what I could see which was apparently not much due to temporary shop lighting and exhaustion. On the more recent inspection, I took it completely apart and used a headlamp to see all of the wonderfulness. I took pics but they degraded to 125k ish when I dumped them from the camera and don't show too much. I'll take new ones before I tear into it next time.
I wish I had the budget to take my own advice all of the time. I could probably bought a few top of the line inverters from a reputable supplier...or built one from scratch... if I accounted for the wasted time and damaged equipment. In the end though, I will end up with a very nice inverter.
The shop is all insulated, heater installed, and almost set completely back up. I plan on getting a few more pics up as soon as I finalize a couple more things inside and scoot everything into it's final position. It's really nice in there and despite the small space should be very productive. I'm really glad that I put it together instead of throwing money away renting a shop and wasting time commuting. Now I have a tool that should last for a really long time and make all kinds of things possible.
mdd0127
100 kW
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Do not buy a Sunforce inverter based upon my recommendation!!! I finished cleaning up the lathe today, installed the belts and the inverter shuts down after running it for ten seconds. It's pulling 900 watts at startup, and 600 watts once running and the supposed 2500 watt inverter can't run it. I don't think there's anything wrong with it. It will run the motor without the belts installed and there isn't much difference in drag with them on. I think it's just typical lying chinese over rating. I'm absolutely sickened by all of this. My reputation with my investors has likely been damaged because of all of this and my build is months behind schedule. There are a few members here that I'll likely have to let down because of all of this. I'm seriously considering putting off the bike build and designing something to eliminate companies that sell disposable, garbage import products completely. Any ideas?
I guess I'll be digging into the 5000 watt inverter tomorrow and getting going on rebuilding it. I don't know what else to do.
I guess I'll be digging into the 5000 watt inverter tomorrow and getting going on rebuilding it. I don't know what else to do.
Unfortunately I suspect they rated it as it's momentary peak power capability, as that is what I usually see with most products like inverters. Rarely can they handle a constant load of even 1/3 of what they say the rating is, and most of the time a lot less than that.
On the other hand, at least yours shuts down gracefully, rather than just exploding in a ball of fire like a lot of these things do.
On the other hand, at least yours shuts down gracefully, rather than just exploding in a ball of fire like a lot of these things do.
mdd0127
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If I couldn't get a refund on this one, I guarantee you I would make it explode into a fireball.
The rating was supposed to be 2500 watts continuous and 4500 peak but I guess ratings don't mean anything anymore. I'm looking at Magnum inverters now as a hopefully reliable solution and will put the order together to rebuild the blown up one tomorrow. I think when I get it back together and working well, I'll try to sell it and recoup some costs. I think it will be worth more than I paid for it once I've gone thought it. Might just keep it as a backup???
The rating was supposed to be 2500 watts continuous and 4500 peak but I guess ratings don't mean anything anymore. I'm looking at Magnum inverters now as a hopefully reliable solution and will put the order together to rebuild the blown up one tomorrow. I think when I get it back together and working well, I'll try to sell it and recoup some costs. I think it will be worth more than I paid for it once I've gone thought it. Might just keep it as a backup???
Harold in CR
100 kW
Hi
This guy does remarkable work on building wind turbines. He uses Schumacher (Schumacher Racing) Inverters to run his house and farm machine shop, all off grid. He uses 12V Inverters. Before anyone starts picking on losses and such, here is a message he sent me, about what he uses and does.
For what you are doing with that Mobile shop, IF you would like to contact this guy, I will see if he would respond to you.
This guy does remarkable work on building wind turbines. He uses Schumacher (Schumacher Racing) Inverters to run his house and farm machine shop, all off grid. He uses 12V Inverters. Before anyone starts picking on losses and such, here is a message he sent me, about what he uses and does.
For what you are doing with that Mobile shop, IF you would like to contact this guy, I will see if he would respond to you.
bigmoose
1 MW
I am wondering if the inverters are choking on the power factor when tied to highly inductive loads? When you mentioned your loads, motors and fluorescent lights (if old style inductive ballasts) they would have a low power factor. To help diagnose, can you run a purely resistive load on these inverters and see what their performance is? Like light bulbs of a big resistive heater? If the results are positive, then you can try dithering some small oil filled capacitors across the motors and see if it helps.
mdd0127
100 kW
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All of the lights are new and start very easily with my 400 watt black and decker inverter. It will also run any motor in the shop individually....even the lathe if the belts aren't hooked up. The problem I'm having is with companies that have become blinded to honesty by easy profits and cheap overseas labor.
To test my theory that the Sunforce inverter is just junk and over rated, I hooked up a 1500 watt heat gun to the 2500 watt inverter and it won't run. The inverter just starts beeping and shuts down. If I were rating this thing, I would put it at 600 watts continuous and 800 peak. That's just sad for something that's advertised as putting out 2500 continuous watts.
The inverter from dcacpower actually put out a decent amount of power when it was in one of it's working moods. I actually loaded it down with a running 3 hp air compressor and the 1500 watt heat gun and it didn't even flinch. That was a 4200 watt load. That unit is rated at 5kw continuous and 10kw surge so that test shouldn't have damaged it. Hopefully, when I replace the garbage recycled components inside, it will be a reliable unit that I can either sell or keep as a backup.
I had a good conversation with wholesale solar about the Magnum inverters and feel pretty confident in one of those. Now, I just need to figure out how to pay for one.
To reply to the post about the guy tying a bunch of inverters together, it sounds awesome and will probably be something I try at some point but for now, I need a bolt in, proven solution.
To test my theory that the Sunforce inverter is just junk and over rated, I hooked up a 1500 watt heat gun to the 2500 watt inverter and it won't run. The inverter just starts beeping and shuts down. If I were rating this thing, I would put it at 600 watts continuous and 800 peak. That's just sad for something that's advertised as putting out 2500 continuous watts.
The inverter from dcacpower actually put out a decent amount of power when it was in one of it's working moods. I actually loaded it down with a running 3 hp air compressor and the 1500 watt heat gun and it didn't even flinch. That was a 4200 watt load. That unit is rated at 5kw continuous and 10kw surge so that test shouldn't have damaged it. Hopefully, when I replace the garbage recycled components inside, it will be a reliable unit that I can either sell or keep as a backup.
I had a good conversation with wholesale solar about the Magnum inverters and feel pretty confident in one of those. Now, I just need to figure out how to pay for one.
To reply to the post about the guy tying a bunch of inverters together, it sounds awesome and will probably be something I try at some point but for now, I need a bolt in, proven solution.
marty
1 MW
These inverters were recommended by my cousin, the solar guy.
Xantrex
http://www.xantrex.com/
Xantrex
http://www.xantrex.com/
Harold in CR
100 kW
Mostly I was posting about the Schumacher brand. USA Company. Can't beat the price, if you buy from where I posted. I'm going with them, as soon as I get my power systems set up. Guy had Xantrex and switched and is VERY happy.
mdd0127
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I have a Schumaker charger and it's well built. Like the old stuff. There's no computer in it. When you turn it on, it puts out voltage. I had to search forever to find one that didn't think it was smarter than I am. Their inverters look nice and the price is definitely right. I might pick up one for backup.
I do have something I've been wondering about though. Has anyone ever ran CNC equipment, or sensitive electronic testing equipment like an oscilloscope on a modified sine inverter? All of the advice I've found says that pure sine is the way to go but no one has been sure or really tried it. I have a Taig DSLS3000 system with encoders that track stepper movement and it's little controller board seems pretty sensitive. Any thoughts on this?
I do have something I've been wondering about though. Has anyone ever ran CNC equipment, or sensitive electronic testing equipment like an oscilloscope on a modified sine inverter? All of the advice I've found says that pure sine is the way to go but no one has been sure or really tried it. I have a Taig DSLS3000 system with encoders that track stepper movement and it's little controller board seems pretty sensitive. Any thoughts on this?
Harold in CR
100 kW
The guy I wrote about does machining. Not sure if it's CNC or not, but, I will ask him.
Edit:
Guy uses HNC, Hand Numerical Control for his Machining.
:lol:
Edit:
Guy uses HNC, Hand Numerical Control for his Machining.
:lol:
mdd0127
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I just got a HNC machine too. I also had a revelation today. It's one of those big stupid ones where the answer was right in front of your face....like a carrying around the pen you're looking for type of thing. Anyway, I have a 10kw generator head mounted on the engine of the box truck so until I can get the inverter situation fixed, I can plug the lathe into the generator. 
I'm not near talented enough to run the lathe and the tig welder simultaneously so it should work out just fine. I've been thinking about why it didn't come to immediately and the only thing I can think of is that the ford fuel injection surges past the governor ever so often and I didn't want to run the CNC mill with it so there was a no mill on the generator thought in my head. The manual lathe should run perfectly on it. I feel like a complete idiot that I didn't think of this until today but I guess I've got a lot going on. 
If the CNC setup will run on the Sunforce, I can get going on the bike build tomorrow!
I'm not near talented enough to run the lathe and the tig welder simultaneously so it should work out just fine. I've been thinking about why it didn't come to immediately and the only thing I can think of is that the ford fuel injection surges past the governor ever so often and I didn't want to run the CNC mill with it so there was a no mill on the generator thought in my head. The manual lathe should run perfectly on it. I feel like a complete idiot that I didn't think of this until today but I guess I've got a lot going on. If the CNC setup will run on the Sunforce, I can get going on the bike build tomorrow!
mdd0127
100 kW
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Quick update. Everything's working. The Sunforce can run the lights and smaller equipment and the generator easily runs the lathe. The Sunforce is a 900 watt inverter. Period. It might make 2500 watts continuous in a parallel dimension or something but not here. Oh well. I need it for now. On very low speed lathe operations, if I spin up the chuck with my hand a little first, it will run off the inverter too. I've been working on organizing everything and finding places for all of the tools and supplies. I've been digging through totes, tool boxes, and piles of things on shelves. It's counterproductive. , I did quick basic setups/alignments on the mill and lathe mill combo but have been doing some more accurate tuning on the machining equipment. I've also shortened the conduit and hung it back up, finalized the mounting location for the sunfarce, etc over the last couple of weeks. I also did a small job turning down some hardened shafts on little armatures for rc motors. I had to do a very unconventional setup involving a dremel tool with a cutoff wheel mounted in the lathe tool post to avoid shaft deflection but they turned out very nice. Now that all of the tools work, I have a few little things to finish up and will be prototype building like a madman over the next couple of months.
Evoforce
10 kW
Having a run capacitor for the initial load while starting up would help you.
mdd0127
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I have to report that everything is working very well. It's been cloudy and the batteries haven't reached 100% charge in a week or so but they've never been below 56% and were at 95% when I shut it down tonight. I've been running the CNC almost constantly and also running the design computer a lot along with lights, other random tools, and a few into the night stints on the lathe, and it seems like the power system/battery bank is sized appropriately. The Kaneka panels are rated for 67 volts at 0.9A each and in full sun, regardless of angle or time of day, the charge controller sees between 60 and 75 volts, and 6.5 to 10A in. When it's cloudy, they're much more sensitive to angle and they run around 60 volts and 4A out. Not bad for a 600 watt array. I'm amazingly impressed with the cheapest solar panels in existence and hope to purchase many more of them in the future. The Outback charge controller is awesome too but the fan scares me sometimes. It comes on with authority. I've also been running the generator to do some welding which is augmenting the solar charging.
Speaking of the welder, it works even better now. I was having trouble with 1/4" aluminum but can melt immediately now if I'm not careful. The generator setup was letting the voltage sag but I couldn't hear it or see it when tigging. I tried the plasma cutter and realized that the governor couldn't keep the voltage steady enough so I changed the generator setup again. I'm not sure of the exact sprocket tooth count numbers right off hand but I re-geared it so the engine revs at 2500 rpm to run the generator at 3600. It will definitely use more fuel but it runs so much more smoothly it's worth it. I'm absolutely sure the engine will run the generator head perfectly at lower rpm and would really rather it did but the ford fuel injection doesn't "clean up" until it's revved up a little and 1300 rpm was too low. The final engine rpm was a result of using what I had lying around. I might cut one more sprocket to get it to somewhere between 1800-200rpm but it's a low priority.
Speaking of the welder, it works even better now. I was having trouble with 1/4" aluminum but can melt immediately now if I'm not careful. The generator setup was letting the voltage sag but I couldn't hear it or see it when tigging. I tried the plasma cutter and realized that the governor couldn't keep the voltage steady enough so I changed the generator setup again. I'm not sure of the exact sprocket tooth count numbers right off hand but I re-geared it so the engine revs at 2500 rpm to run the generator at 3600. It will definitely use more fuel but it runs so much more smoothly it's worth it. I'm absolutely sure the engine will run the generator head perfectly at lower rpm and would really rather it did but the ford fuel injection doesn't "clean up" until it's revved up a little and 1300 rpm was too low. The final engine rpm was a result of using what I had lying around. I might cut one more sprocket to get it to somewhere between 1800-200rpm but it's a low priority.
vanilla ice
1 MW
Nice updates, my favorite vehicle (2, 4, 6 or any #wheels) on the whole forum ever btw..
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