new eZip motor

[Sunder]

I ordered (and just received Monday) the 4Ah version of those, and I am going to put them in put them in parallel for an 8Ah battery.

I need about 5-6Ah @ 48v to get to work, so building itike that gave me a bit of flexibility as to how I can configure them.

I'm currently using 8Ah of 12S Turnigy Graphene. They are good batteries now, but I bet you in a year's time, they will be sagging a lot and have lost capacity.

My ride to work is really nice. There's a "slow" section through parks where I keep it to mid 30km/h, and some freeway with dedicated bike lanes, where I hit 65km/h due to a hill (motor can't go that fast).

It only takes me 10 mins longer than bus or motorcycle, and it gives me the opportunity to unwind, destress before I get to work/home. Really enjoying electric biking again.

 

[latecurtis]

It only takes me 10 mins longer than bus or motorcycle, and it gives me the opportunity to unwind, destress before I get to work/home. Really enjoying electric biking again.

Yea. I have been walking a lot and taking buses. The danger of getting ran over or hitting a patch of ice and hurting myself have prevented me from fixing the flat tire I got since the blowout when I hit a bad section of road.

Also I need to walk whenever I can to lose weight. I am battling both high blood pressure and type 2 diabetes. Both can be reversed if I can shed enough pounds. I also will be buying a truck or car soon which unfortunately will be gas powered as I wont ever be able to afford an electric car or hybrid.

Someday though I will be building and riding e bikes again. I look forwards to the day. Now though is just not the time. Thanks.

LC. out.

 

[latecurtis]

As the Hub motor no longer Turns and the Lipo fire no longer Burns.

it is almost spring. my batteries have been sitting for months now in the closet and the bike sits in the hall with a flat tire and broken thumb throttle.

i may have a part time job coming up in a couple months when the grass grows running a blower behind a land scarping crew. it is not a sure thing but might happen. either way i am fixing the tire soon and ordering a waterproof thumb throttle.

i also am testing my old lithium ion packs and topping off the charge. i will also need to order cables to combine the 6P Samsung and 4P SONA packs for 10P. I believe that i was told awhile back to do that ????? Is my recollection correct ? I think DA and someone else said to put those in parallel. Could someone please verify that information as i dont need to make any mistakes and has been awhile since my last post. thanks.

LC out.

 

[Sunder]

Not sure what context that advice was given, but if you're carrying both anyway, then yes, joining them is almost always good advice.

It'll be good to see you active again - riding, and even working. Get some extra money, and use the nice weather to get out there!

I've been loving my ride into work, rain or shine. See my new thread here: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=104679

How's the old lady, and the locals? Found any friends you can spend time with, non-destructively, and without too much alcohol?

Hope you're well.

 

[latecurtis]

I finally come to a point in my life where I truly understand some things that have baffled me for many years now. I often wondered why more people especially highly intelligent people are not more actively involved in life extension research and possible immortality thru science and research.

 

[Sunder]

That's rather morbid.

I've been doing a bit of reflection on that lately, for two reasons. One, I celebrated my halfway mark:

1. I've been working for 22 years, and it's another 22 years until I can legally retire (well, I can retire whenever I can afford to, but it's the earliest I can access my retirement funds).

2. I'm now half way to the median life expectancy for men in Australia.

Reason two? Well, Novel Coronavirus. Looks like around 2% of us will catch it and die in the next couple years unless a vaccine comes out way sooner than expected.

My life's been pretty good. It's had its share difficulties. I've had depression (not medical, just a long period of emotional turmoil for various reasons), suffered loss, been stressed for long periods close to break down. But I've enjoyed a lot too. Got a passport filled with the stamps for 40 countries. I married a wonderful woman, and I have two cute kids. I have a job I enjoy, and while I'm not rich and have never aimed to be, I've always had more than I've wanted.

Sure, there's more I want. I want to spend more time with my wife and kids. I want to mountain bike the Colorado mountains. I want to do the Eurovelo. I want to see Antarctica and the Amazon forest(not by bike though). I want to sit in the Swiss alps with a cheese fondue keeping me warm, and go to a real Texas BBQ and a Brazilian one too.

But if I don't get to do any of that, then I've had more than my fair share of good times and blessings in my half of an average life, than most people will ever get in their full one. And more importantly, I know where I'm going. This life is not the end. It's just the start. It's too long to get into here, but I'm convinced that the promises of the bible are the truth, and not the mad writings of the uneducated, a collection of folk tales, or a conman trying to control people.

I sometimes wonder how those with no belief in something bigger than a chemical reaction - a fluke of a particular set of physics as the result of the big bang, don't just get nihilistic, or worse, fatalistic. My only reasonable conclusion is that they never stop to think about whether life has a deeper meaning than chasing the next pleasure or high, or avoiding as much pain as they can. A sales trainer told me a couple weeks ago: "Nobody will listen to you rattle off all the most impressive facts, if they have no meaning, but people will listen to you all day if your story has meaning to them". Isn't that true of life? If your life has no meaning, why do people continue? But if people have meaning, then they'll keep interested for as long as it has meaning. It shows in science too - People who retire with no purpose, tend to die young. But people who continue to work - whether paid or unpaid, whether for family, or community, and have a sense of purpose, tend to live much longer.

Anyway, time for bed. Hope your spirits lift soon.

 

[2old]

Past halfway and couldn't have said it better. Just so you know, do the things that statistically keep you healthier (I realize there are no guarantees) and the joys keep coming even if a little more slowly at times.

 

[DrkAngel]

People who live for themselves, and the moment, burn themselves out physically and emotionally, like a sugar or drug high, too late, they realize their life to be empty, so why live?
People with a cause-purpose, tend to grow a better world and pass joy and hope to further generations, making the world worth living in, satisfied and happy to have made the world a bit more of a "heaven", for themselves and future generations?

Personally, not a fan of religion, I am a fan of "God".
The thought of "Heaven" seems unrealistic to many of the more intelligent-educated.
Jewish religion, basis of Christianity and Islam, does not support a Heaven for humans!

Consider that some entity created the Universe, seems designed(?), it would have to be from something ... or from himself!
An all encompassing entity, including ourselves?
The Bible says that God "spoke" everything into being ...
... consider that being remembered in the mind of God might be an even more "real", and immortal, existence ... Heaven?

 

[john61ct]

Life for most of us has no intrinsic meaning or value.

We need to find or create that for ourselves.

And there is no higher priority project, at least once our ongoing survival is secure.

 

[latecurtis]

https://www.domesticatedcompanion.com/soon-you-may-be-able-to-live-forever-leading-scientists-say/

https://primepolitical.com/2019/04/26/hacking-reality-computer-simulation/

There is a lot there to wrap your brain around. It is not just a few people like Elon Musk who believe but many top minds of are time are going on board with this matrix theory.

https://www.earthfiles.com/2019/12/27/part-1-is-our-universe-also-a-3-d-hologram-3/

https://www.earthfiles.com/2019/12/29/part-2-keys-to-the-cosmos-fractal-math-frequencies-and-wave-patterns-3/

When searching google I like to go back 6 months to a year at most for recent information. I like the newest stuff. Finding the truth is about as likely as dairy cows evolving to grow wings and soaring thru the clouds at 10,000 feet within the next ten years.

However for some of us we just can't let it go and cannot help but to keep seeking the truth no matter how impossible it is to find. It is our main purpose to exist. I happen to be one of those type that will never stop searching for answers.

Thanks.

LC. out.

 

[latecurtis]

As the Hub Motor Turns and the LiPo Fire Burns

https://www.ebay.com/itm/3000W-170KV-Brushless-Sensorless-Motor-Electric-Skateboard-Scooter-Waterproof-US/233389905657?_trkparms=aid%3D555021%26algo%3DPL.SIMRVI%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20190711100440%26meid%3Db7c32aff801047a3b58aa37658e61bbb%26pid%3D100752%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D18%26mehot%3Dco%26sd%3D264248819429%26itm%3D233389905657%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplRVIAMLv5WebWithPLRVIOnTopCombiner&_trksid=p2047675.c100752.m1982

We all know and saw on this forum aprox. 1 to 2 years ago in the e bike workshop battery packs being soldered and built

When the next e bike workshop happens a 96 cell 16S = 6P pack will happen.

What happens next is anyone's guess.

170 by 35 volts is a high number. 6120 is high for a sprocket and gearing without expensive gear reduction like jackshaft, However the 1,800 W brushless motor looks like a perfect motor for an e bike. But which one. They come in two speeds.

https://prnt.sc/r9tb3b

https://www.ebay.com/itm/48V-1800W-Electric-Brushless-Controller-motor-grip-ATV-Go-Kart-Scooter-1800-Watt/264248819429?hash=item3d8674fee5:g:hYYAAOSwoFVaW0GN

I saw a 20 inch bike today with a fat tire on the back, It was a freewheel and probably a 10 speed or more with a freewheel that could accommodate a freewheel clutch from electric scooter parts.

I will go at least 43 mph on an electric bike by summer hopefully.

Thanks.

LC out.

 

[Sunder]

We all know and saw on this forum aprox. 1 to 2 years ago in the e bike workshop battery packs being soldered and built

So, I know you don't like soldering, and the quality of your joints probably wouldn't meet NASA standards... So, have you thought about spot welding? I always thought spot welding machines were $150+, and took up a lot of room, but this is an interesting one I hadn't seen before:

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/For-18650-26650-DIY-Portable-12V-Battery-Energy-Storage-Spot-Welder-Machine-XT60/352898611622?hash=item522a6579a6:g:CmoAAOSw8A1d-0k1

It runs off a 3S lipo battery, and despite it saying don't use 18650s as the power source, you could probably use one if you had a few in parallel. I doubt it would join really thick tabs, but 0.6mm nickel strip to 18650s? That's gotta be towards the lower end of requirements.

I was thinking of getting one to spot weld pure aluminium tabs on some big LTO cells. Dad needs a new battery at his farm.

 

[amberwolf]

have you seen the kweld, here on the forum? or other similar ones?

 

[latecurtis]

I remember the 30 watt soldering irons were garbage and could not properly melt the solder.

The 60 watt was better. I scratched up the surface of the top of the 18650 cell with a drywall screw. The solder was completely melted. The bonds were strong and proper but still got criticized for my work. The small area did not require anything more than a standard soldering tip. The extra tips were not needed. A rough surface and proper temperature of solder was important. Not some pre solder technique where you apply a drop of solder then have to re melt the solder when attaching the wire. Too complicated.

I will solder again and will start with junk cells for practice. I will see how much weight I can hang from the wire soldered to the cell after that to totally prove my solder joints are quality. I believe I already did on one of my posts earlier in e bike workshop 101.

Thanks

LC out.

PS.

It might be awhile as all that stuff is still in my 10 by 10 storage 500 miles away. It is now difficult to prove anyone wrong as I have nothing to work with. I will build my new packs exactly how I did my packs before which worked perfect for several months before I made a big mistake hooking them up to a switch causing a direct short and destroying 1/2 of the packs I built. The same BMSs did not protect both 2P packs. 1 BMS failed in short circuit protection so the 2P 10S pack in storage could still work. Any future packs I build WILL work.

I build e bikes and am good at it. I just cant build them right now.


LC out,

 

[Sunder]

have you seen the kweld, here on the forum? or other similar ones?

I had seen it earlier, but hadn't really been of interest to me until recently. I mostly used either RC Lipo which can be soldered, or Prismatic LiFePo4/LTO which used screw connectors.

It would be nice to have a decent spot welder, but space is an issue, which is why I was looking at these mini ones. If you think they are really worth it, I'd be keen on getting a pre-made one, rather than a kit, as the interest is in the use, not in the assembly, but if they are just "okay" I'll probably get a 240v plug into wall model.

 

[amberwolf]

It would be nice to have a decent spot welder, but space is an issue, which is why I was looking at these mini ones. If you think they are really worth it, I'd be keen on getting a pre-made one, rather than a kit, as the interest is in the use, not in the assembly, but if they are just "okay" I'll probably get a 240v plug into wall model.

i'd ask spinningmagnets about the various mini spot welders; he seems to have been keeping an eye on these things and been involved with various types enough to likely be able to help you pick one, or at least what *not* to get.

 

[latecurtis]

As the Hub Motor turns and the LiPo Fire Burns. On the road again soon. Hopefully with GPS navigation.

Since I have been in Ohio I must have got lost more than a dozen times. Probably several dozen. I am not one of those people with a natural sense of direction.

It is one of the reasons I have not rode my e bike in awhile. The other is the flat tire and broken thumb throttle. Also the heavy traffic.

For awhile I had a cheap android Obama phone which had a google navigation app but was extremely difficult to work especially when snowing and blowing , wind and rain as I went to Belden village close to a dozen times in the last few months and to doctors appointments in the North Canton area.

I used the google app. when walking to find the doctors and bus station and also when on the bus to know where to get off. As far as a phone goes it was a really cheap and annoying device. You could hardly hear it ring and took about 2 minutes just to turn on and the battery was cheap Chinese garbage. It also beeped and made all kinds of annoying noises all the time for no reason. It acted like it was having a seizure or something.

I wont go into details but about a week ago I called home to my spouse as I have a landline phone and wanted to know what she needed at the store. The call cut off and could not call back as was stuck on airplane mode. I tried for about 5 minutes to get it out of airplane mode and failed. I am sure you can all guess what happened next. :lol:

Since then I got a flip track phone for 13 bucks and a 15 dollar card with 500 minutes talk and text. It rings loud and the buttons light and is so much easier to use as a phone and does voice mail. As far as a phone goes is way better than android or smart phones. It turns on much faster and way better for talking. If I had to call 911 I would be dead by the time the android phone turned on.

Needless to say I no longer own the phone and tried several times to get a replacement upgrade but am still waiting for my name to get out of the system as they wont mail replacement to a PO. box and I don't get mail here because of the neighborhood. I have to get one at the booth where I signed up.

Yesterday was the last straw. Due to my shoulder , back , toe and right knee pain which got progressively worse due to Osteo arthritis I got a doctors recommendation for medical cannabis here in Ohio. I received my state issued card and was on my way to the dispensary and even printed out a google map at the library. The bus driver had no idea where it was and got lost in a terrible scary neighborhood with 200 bucks on me.

I know myself , and if someone pulled a gun on me I would have probably blasted them in the face and got myself shot dead before I would hand them my cash. For me a GPS portable navigator is something I just cant live without. I went and bought one at best buy for 89 bucks. It came to 95 with tax.

I figured I could mount it to my handlebars as soon as I get the e bike going. It could save my life as when lost with low battery I get anxiety attacks. I had bad anxiety when I hit that hole in the grass last July and seriously injured my right shoulder and surgery was highly recommended. I have not rode much at all since then.

I need this GPS navigator whether I am walking , e biking or driving a vehicle but especially driving a vehicle or an e bike so I don't get high stress and anxiety. When I opened the box It has a cord and adapter for a cigarette lighter. I did not even realize vehicles still had those. It has a mini to regular USB but the device was completely dead. It says it needs a special USB block.

10V is minimum for a power block but 12V is what I need. It is a Garmin Drive 52. marked down from 120 to 89 bucks. It says that the charging will be very slow without the correct charging block which is separate.

My two questions here are e bike related as will be using the GPS every time I ride my bike especially any distance. I am thinking about a 12V lithium ion battery or 3 - 18650 cells in series with a 3S charger. It should not be difficult to do and can cut the wires off the cigarette lighter plug for a vehicle and plug it in to the 3S Lithium ion pack.

The second question is how to mount the GPS to my e bike handle bars but not permanent as will be needing it on foot , bus or motor vehicle also. I plan on fixing my tire and ordering a new thumb throttle as it broke off when I hurt myself last summer.

Please let me know what you all think and thanks.

LC out.

 

[tomjasz]

I purchased this empty case. And use salvage batteries. Works great for my battery warmer, iPhone, addition lighting, and more!

 

[latecurtis]

Thank you. I will order one when I order my new thumb throttle.

Things I need to work on after I get the tire and thumb throttle fixed is mounting the GPS / 12V battery block as well as a multi-meter which I can hook to the e bike batteries in parallel. This way I will know I am traveling in the right direction as well as know how much power my old batteries have during the trip and a cheap multi-meter should read voltage sag under load.

Since multi-meters are cheap I could mount it permanent. However the GPS and 12V block need to be easily unhooked from the e bike for other use.

The other big thing I need to upgrade/change is a better waterproofing method so my electronics do not get wet as it rained at least 2 out of 3 days last Spring and summer. The amount of rain we get in Ohio is ridiculous. It is the main reason I hurt myself hitting that hole last summer. It started raining and my electronics were exposed. I was looking for a plastic bag at Auto Zone and was stressed out. It can not happen again. I need perfect waterproofing or there is no sense in riding my e bike again.

Thanks and any ideas will help.

LC out.


3/8/20

I still have an issue with patience. However will still order the case for the three 18650 cells but not until I get my storage from NY state as I have a lot of 18650 cells from projects I can use. I do not wish to order more for the case. The case is the better choice as is smaller and lightweight. The case is perfect for walking with my GPS as it can fit in my shirt pocket but for an e bike these little SLAs will do the job. Wall-mart had a 12V SLA which was 7.4 Ah I believe but weighed almost twice as much as these two 4.5 Ah SLAs.

The charger has a switch for 6V or 12V charging. I was very concerned about reverse polarity so got a 12V power outlet. The GPS came with the plug for that so I wont need to cut the wire and can plug it in to a vehicle when I get one.

I am now going to build this thing and test it. Fully charged SLAs are 13.3V as I remember and just googled car voltage and is about 14V with the vehicle running and the alternator charging the car battery so over voltage should not be a problem for the GPS navigator.

 

[latecurtis]

As The Hub Motor Turns and the LiPo Fire Burns. E bike workshop 101.

Yes it has been awhile. This is the first e bike workshop in over a year. It feels great to be back at building and inventing something again.

Wall-Mart did not have any battery back up for cell phones or tablets with the correct voltage. They were all 5 volts.

I have no soldering iron or crimping tool. I used my teeth.

I was wondering about the yellow volt going thru the battery icon on the top when plugged in. That means it is not running off the internal battery as when I unplug the GPS I get a screen saying that external power has been dis connected and will shut off and gives me a countdown and option to cancel the shut down. Then the internal battery icon is green with no yellow bolt.


Thanks

LC out.

 

[latecurtis]

It was a little expensive but worth it I think. The SLAs were 10 bucks each and the charger 12 bucks. The connecters about 3 bucks and the 6 foot house extension cord less than 2 bucks. I already had the duct and electrical tape. I also had the piece of wood and hand saw to cut it.

The cord is long enough that I can carry the external 12V pack in my back pack and GPS in my front jacket pocket when walking.

Also if there is no 12V outlet in the next vehicle I get no worries. I can also easily mount the GPS to my handle bar now as I bought that also for 15 bucks at Wall-Mart.

I will still get a replacement android phone as the GPS lacks a web browser. However I did type in speedway on the way to Wall-Mart where I know there was an Allpoint ATM as it is free to take money out there and it came up on the screen but when I typed in Allpoint I got no information. Also if I am somewhere I have never been it wont give me an exact address and zip code where a web browser will.

As a navigator it is way better than any android or smart phone app. I had much trouble with the app and sometimes walked several blocks in the wrong direction before realizing my mistake. Basically a flip phone is way better for calling someone and getting messages and a GPS navigator is way better than any app on a smart or android phone but for a small portable web browser with no Wi fy the android phone serves it's purpose.

This week I will fix the tire and mount the GPS. There is no easy way to waterproof all this though. I will probably have to get some clear plastic bags and use them if it rains.

Thanks.

LC out.

3/9/20 4:21 PM

I wrapped a lot of tape , electrical and duct around the wires to make sure the clips dont slide off the terminals. It will go in a pouch of some kind which will go inside my back pack. It will allow me to carry it as well as cans of beer without anything metal shorting out the pack by coming in contact with the terminals which I can't cover with tape as I need to charge it.

I am calibrating my multi meter with the fully charged 12V pack which should read 13V to 13.3V maximum. After that I am testing and charging the 4P and 6P 36V lithium ion packs and if I feel really ambitious will put in the new tube I also picked up last night at Wall-Mart.

Note that the lithium packs were fully charged but have been sitting for several months on time out.

OK. 13.2V fully charged overnight for the two brand new 6V - SLAs in series. 40.6 for the 6P genuine Samsung packs and 42.3 for the 4P SONA packs. That is almost a 2V difference between the Samsung and SONA packs. Note I separated all the packs to 2P and the measurements were exactly the same. each Samsung pack was 40.6V and each of the SONA packs were 42.3V.

Do you guys still recommend combining them with an almost 2V difference ??? Please let me know.

LC. out.

 

[Sunder]

I basically don't even bother to use my in-car GPS any more, Android GPS is so good. You're probably running with a cheap phone that isn't running the latest version, and has a weak GPS signal. For me, reasons it's better:

1. It's more accurate - The car GPS can be 20-30m behind at times, so when streets are close together, I pass the turn off before it says to turn.

2. It's fast - if you take a wrong turn, it can recalculate in 2-3 seconds, not 20-30, meaning you don't have to pull over.

3. It deals with ambiguity well. Spell the street name wrong? It'll still offer suggestions. Want to go to a restaurant or business, rather than an address? Not only can it handle that, it can suggest other businesses similar nearby - and that's how it makes money.

4. It considers traffic. Highway jammed? It'll suggest some back streets to work around it.

5. It's voice activated. "Okay Google, direct me to 123 This Street, Thatsuburb", and I don't have to touch it while driving/riding.

On top of that, I carry my phone everywhere. It's a tool of the trade as well as my way of staying in touch, so I don't have to carry any extra devices, it's always charged, and Oh, and did I mention that I use my phone for road tuning my eBike? (It shows real data if I am on my bike)





All that said, my phone cost $1800AUD, which for a lot of people is a month's wage here. My work contributes to a bit of that, since I use it for work, but to me, it's worth every cent.

Anyway, your GPS is only better than your phone GPS, likely because your phone is so old. Sales of dedicated GPSes are almost non existent. Even new car manufacturers are starting to put in Phone Mirroring software, rather than their own GPS in, because they know people prefer to have their own phone's GPS shown on their car dash, than the car's GPS.

Hope you're holding up well over there. Coronavirus is getting scary here, with quite a few infections just 200 metres away from where my wife works, and a whole building evacuated and sent home for two weeks half a km from where I work. As we are heading into winter, it's going to get a lot worse over here, and hopefully better for you guys over there.

 

[latecurtis]

I basically don't even bother to use my in-car GPS any more, Android GPS is so good. You're probably running with a cheap phone that isn't running the latest version, and has a weak GPS signal. For me, reasons it's better:

My android phone was cheap. I will be getting an upgrade for 25 bucks (Obama free government phone)

There were a lot of things I did not like about the app. I used. One was the arrow was hard to follow and went in the wrong direction several times and probably walked a half a mile a couple times as the arrow was not really an arrow and was difficult to launch.

The GPS navigator hooks to the laptop and upgrades maps regular and the arrow is very easy to follow as if I turn right or left from the straight path the arrow responds immediately. It also turns off and on Quickly. If I get a better android phone I may use both. The important thing about the phone for me is the web browser.

Tomjase posted a better back up as is lighter and when I get my storage and my 18650 cells I will order it but for now will use the SLAs. I went to Wall-Mart and now have pouches for both 36V Lithium ion packs and one for the 12V back up for the GPS. The bottom pic shows the 12V pack and is a tight squeeze. It could have been slightly larger as it just zips up and the 12V adapter does fit however the 12V charger wont but it should last a long time.

It was only 5 bucks for the pouch and also 5 bucks for the new hyper tough tool bag was slightly too big for the SONA packs but is ok as it should be perfect when I start building larger packs in the future. The Samsung packs are in the bag I already had and fit perfect.

I still need to work on the bike.

Thanks for posting.

LC out.

 

[latecurtis]

As the Hub Motor Turns and the LiPo Fire Burns. The bike is ready to roll but no place is safe to go.

I fixed the flat tire. I am not going to work out any more at the YMCA for awhile as it is a public place. I am taking out about 80 bucks from the ATM so I don;t have to go back for awhile.

I can get my beer and groceries at the same time at one store except for Sunday so might stock up on beer today.

The fewer places I go the better. This could be the end of the human race. I wont be seen on any busses for a very long time. My doctors appointments and tests for my heart condition will have to wait for several months at least and wont be getting my stuff out of NY any time soon.

I don't buy the pile of horse crap they are saying that these type of viruses came from animals and were passed to humans. It is very obvious to me and many others this is population control as it targets elderly people for death. I did research and not many children are getting sick. That proves beyond a doubt it is a man made virus.

It even makes sense that it was made in China as they are extremely over populated however I do not blame it all on China as I am sure other countries and governments are in on it also to kill off old people.

The common Chinese person is poor over there and at the mercy of the evil government. The Chinese people here don't have A clue and they are being singled out. If you want to blame someone how about starting with the United Nations.

They will continue to lie to all of us. I have no doubt in my mind there is a cure but we will probably never live to see it. Thanks.

LC. out.

 

[markz]

Be like Michael Jackson
Buy a mask
Where ---->A<----- glove, yes just one