new eZip motor

[latecurtis]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWkyFmFjf68&feature=youtu.be

http://prntscr.com/elrdmh

ok I got it to work for 1, 000 watts.

The calculator works.

However this is impossible.

http://prntscr.com/elrdys

Basically the day an e bike will climb crane st. hill at 20 mph with 1,000 watts of power will be the same day that cows grow wings and fly. :lol:

10 mph would be surprising with 1,000 watts and that would be if the bike were geared for less than 15 mph with a 1,000 watt motor. Crane st hill is like I said, a bear of a hill.

However my ol ladys son John is looking for a small motorcycle frame for the FX motor. That will climb any hill a lot faster than 20 mph. :lol: He also has the welding equipment needed to mount the motor.

http://prntscr.com/elrhwk


This however is the most questionable data. congress is slightly steeper at the bottom but levels off about halfway up and then not as steep the rest of the way.
Crane st. is the same grade all the way to the top. It is very evident when walking or TRYING to pedal. There is no way possible that those numbers make any sense.

congress = 9.6 % grade
crane = 6% grade.




Thanks.
LC. out.

 

[DrkAngel]

Hell ... with my 450w (24V) output motor pushed to 625w (33.3V) output and using my "Attack them Hills!" methodology, I've run up the 2 block 26.8% grade W. Sullivan St and hit the top at 16mph! - (2009 eZip Trailz LS geared for 20mph "legal" top speed.)

Of course, the motor alone isn't dragging my 200lb butt up the hill, I'm also pulling my own weight ... as best I can ...

In order to provide reasonable pedal assist, seat must be placed high enough to allow full leg extension!
Pedal assisting on a 20" is almost certain to be pitiful >> with damaging knee stress.

. "Proper" seat adjustment
Best pedal assist seat height tends to leave the average cyclist with barely one tippy toe touching the ground at a stop sign.
Being a cyclist-rider more concerned with range and comfort, modest to moderate assist, I try to set seat height slightly more "reasonably".
My determined "optimal" height is with one legged flat footed, on pedal, full leg extension, with perineum pressure relief by cocking hips slightly.
Maximum assist is available by using toe extension and lifting off saddle slightly while still maintaining "horn" between thighs.
1 hour @ 20mph, in the saddle, can be comfortable to tolerable.

 

[Sunder]

LC... If it ever comes to deciding whether a publicly posted calculator is wrong, or you're wrong, my money is on you. I mean, for starters, do you even know what Tubulars or Hoods are? You're not running them. Why did you select them in the calculator?

I doubt you've had a bike that has come anywhere NEAR 1000w at the wheels. Even have my doubts about your draw at the battery.

If you know how to hook one of these up, I'll have one sent to you, and you can post up some videos, showing how much battery power you're really pulling. It's wireless, so you can leave the sensor in near the battery, and mount the display by your handlebars.

Until then you're just guessing.

 

[DrkAngel]

Watts - electric vs mechanical

Don't forget that Battery watts are not the same as motor output watts!
At best, your (brush) motors are 80% efficient, and only at top cruising speed, if motor is geared optimally for that top speed.
625w (electric) providing 500w (mechanical)
Poor gearing, partial speed, inefficient drive train (tight chain) might limit ...
1000w (electric) providing 250w (mechanical)

5A Alligator Clips

And "39V SLA" through 5A alligator clips will likely provide only the controllers LVC ~30V in a possibly stuttering-shuddering drizzle.
Controller with pot has no LVC and voltage will likely sag much lover, but smoother!

22.2V LiPo is not "25V+" !

Batteries are rated by their working voltage not their peak charged voltage!
If 24V = 500w motor output
Then 22.2V = 462w motor output
... optimally!

 

[DrkAngel]

.
..... Motor Output Profile

Another thing to take into account is that motors only output their rated watts at a specific rpm!

500w motor could push 300lb up a 9.5% grade hill at 8mph, but only if geared optimally for that speed.

When geared for 15-17mph peak output (22.2V vs 24V) will barely struggle up at 2-3mph because watt output to "load" line intersection is a pitiful 100-150w.
Adding an easy 100w of pedal power will help motor to more efficient 300w usable output for 400w total usable and push speed to near 7mph.

 

[latecurtis]

Thank you all for the technical information. We shall soon see what four different electric bicycles will do up the hills in question. Well at least three of them as I am not sure about the 24" bike.
I went thru two variable controllers before I got one that did not fail during take off on the flat. Not sure I want to push it up any big hills.

However with two 36V controllers sitting in a drawer I am thinking about hooking it up so I can plug and unplug with bullets. pretty sure the bike can take either hill at 36V. I also have the 48V controller for 4 SLAs in series but not sure if four SLAs are better than 44V LiPo as the sag thing under load. The SLAs might fail. Also my SLA charging cables are for three SLAs at a time and since I have six SLAs running three at a time is much better and easier than four. Also three is almost exactly 1 HP or 750 watts with the Unite 48V 1,000 watt motor at 36V.

Also you all do realize that the dual motor set up although it is not geared low enough for hills it does have two separate controllers and motors sharing the load where all my other bikes have a single motor and controller doing all the work. That plus the extra traction via two wheels vs one should be factors to consider.

What is the best charging voltage for a 5.0 Turnergy LiPo pack ? I got it set for two amps.

I am charging the old packs today. They are slightly under 4V per cell and balance charging each to 4.2V

I usually charge the two 8.0 packs in parallel at 3.5A

I might try one of the hills today if they charge before dark but I have a doctors appointment tomorrow at 2 PM so I will need them either way.

I am about to lug the 20" bike with the dual motors upstairs as I need to install the other bike computer on it. For $12 each I may get two more so I have one for each bike.

What is awesome is having so many bikes and controllers and different batteries for that matter and with all the technical information here there is an unlimited amount of testing video to do.

Basically I am having fun and is a learning experience for what not to do or what can be done and at what cost as I have a general idea what each bike was to build in US dollars.

I will use the 24" cargo bike for a perfect example. I am not counting the cost of the bike as any bike can be converted. Also I am not counting batteries as most hub motor conversion kits don't come with batteries. It is just the basic cost of the motor , controller , chain , sprockets and materials for the bracket which holds the motor.

motor. $80 with free shipping from e bay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1000-W-48V-DC-electric-motor-w-base-f-scooter-bike-go-kart-minibike-MY1020-/151373055761?hash=item233e898711:g:WEgAAOSw4bVTmvhv

brushed variable controller. $14
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-50V-40A-DC-Motor-Speed-Control-PWM-HHO-Controller-12V-24V-48V-2000W-MAX-TE093/232247503868?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D2220072%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D41668%26meid%3D1399a8e692714a34ac518827b8811504%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D182385179286

60 tooth spoke sprocket. $25
http://www.ebay.com/itm/80cc-Motor-bicycle-GAS-ENGINE-parts-60-teeth-flat-sprocket-only-no-mount-/191731104174?hash=item2ca41079ae:g:X2IAAOSw~bFWOTB7

mounting kit. $9
http://www.ebay.com/itm/9-Hole-Sprocket-Mount-Kit-for-49cc-66cc-80cc-Engine-Motorized-Bicycle-M-PA11-/251215897901?hash=item3a7da2652d

#420 chain $16
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BikeMaster-420-Precision-Roller-Chain-Motorcycle-Drive-420-X-80-/261917450985?hash=item3cfb7f22e9:g:3aAAAMXQlgtTAkNa&vxp=mtr

motor sprocket $15
http://prntscr.com/em3l5i

nuts , bolts and wood for bracket from Home Depot $10

total $169

Yes it may be possible to get a cheap 250 or 500 watt hub motor kit for about the same price however it will not out perform a 1,000 watt Unite motor. An 800 watt or 1,000 watt hub motor kit like the one on the Schwinn and Diamond back will cost at least $100 more for similar performance to a 48V Unite motor.

Estimated speed for the build for a 250 pound person on flat ground is 15 mph at 24V, 21 mph at 36V and 27 mph at 48V.
Gearing is for 16.5 mph at 24V , 24 mph at 36V and 32 mph at 48V. That is using a 20" wheel with the sprockets listed above.

This information is currently being tested and the videos posted on you tube.

Thanks.

LC out.

 

[Sunder]

Yes it may be possible to get a cheap 250 or 500 watt hub motor kit for about the same price however it will not out perform a 1,000 watt Unite motor. An 800 watt or 1,000 watt hub motor kit like the one on the Schwinn and Diamond back will cost at least $100 more for similar performance to a 48V Unite motor.

Autowhattie?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/26-48V-1000W-Ebike-Front-Wheel-Electric-Bicycle-Motor-Conversion-Kit-Motor-Hub-/152211337572?hash=item237080b164:g:FY4AAOSwFV9Xx54J

View attachment 1

Also, most 1000W eBike kits can be modified to run up to 3000w with no additional cooling, simply by soldering the shunt inside the controller.

I'd have that running before you got back from Home Depot. Just don't use your credit card there:

 

[DrkAngel]

I picked up a similar rear wheel for about the same price, couple weeks ago. Haven't done anything with it yet.
Gotta build a 48V battery ...

Has some nice extra features:
1000w 28mph >> 750w 20mph switch! >>> Turbo!
Reverse "switch" - nice for FWD version
Scaleable PAS, based on crank speed

Sorting through my bike "boneyard" looking for appropriate match.

See -48V 1000w 26" eBike Rear Kit $152

 

[latecurtis]

ok. good.

That is the best thing I have ever heard on this post except for the FX motor.

There is no shadow of a doubt you guys are AWSOME !

I started writing some nonsense about that motor up front on the HARO and a winch motor in the back but then saw the 3,000 watt thing and now I realize that it will not only be simpler but also cheaper to go with front and rear 3,000 watts each for 6 kilowatts total. I am not going with Alien power. I have yet to see a fast e bike using Alien power technology. They got a few fast skateboards on youtube.

I have to say it. We are all at the genius level. By myself I could never be close to genius but with you guys coming up with stuff like that it takes me to a genius level.
The Haro V3 will be dual hub motors and 6 kilowatts total.

I may not need the FX motor to beat those pesky four wheelers. I am thinking about getting my motorcycle license and using the FX motor for a highway / race small legal street tricked out crotch rocket. Thanks.
LC out.

 

[Sunder]

3kw at the back wheel with the right voltage and cooling is doable.

3kw at the front wheel is suicidal.

Have you soldered a shunt before? I've seen videos, looks fairly easy, but honestly, not tried it myself.

 

[DrkAngel]

.
... 1st, I must apologize for thinking LC has no idea what the meaning of genius is.

I looked it up ...

Come to find out, the top 3 definitions might be somewhat appropriately applied.

 

[DrkAngel]

3kw at the back wheel with the right voltage and cooling is doable.

3kw at the front wheel is suicidal.

Have you soldered a shunt before? I've seen videos, looks fairly easy, but honestly, not tried it myself.

LC ... If you need some understanding of what a 3kWh front motor is like ...
Prime up your 800w front hub bike.
Find a nice ice covered parking lot.
Start tooling around like some wanton careless fool!

Then amplify the danger, damage and pain by 1500% !!!

 

[latecurtis]

http://alienpowersystem.com/shop/brushless-hub-gearless-sensors-motors/alien-gearless-brushless-hub-motor-sensored/

The thing I like about Alien Power though is the fact that they will customize the motor or controller to your specifications with no extra charge.
Also Bruno Tallot sent me several e mails and answered all my questions promptly and I never even ordered anything.

I do not think their brushless RC type motors rated at 3 kilowatts plus are good for e bikes but mostly for powered skateboards. Mabye for a go cart.
However I priced 5 killowatt and 6 killowatt motors like The Crown and the Crow motor and they are double the price if not more than this 6 killowatt motor Alien power has.

Basically I am looking for a simple build with the Haro V3. I am not looking to solder any controllers or take any motors apart like I did with three Unite motors.
I am looking for rear wheel only and willing to give up on a front hub motor but I am looking for 6 kilowatts at 48 volts not 72 or 84V. However if three 10.0 - 6S packs could work then I would agree to a 72V custom motor or 75V if Alien power can accommodate it.

4.2 volt fully charged LiPo packs are usually 4.175 a few minutes after fully balance charging. 4.175 * 18 = 75.15V. Therefore 80V caps would work and I could use three 10.0 6S LiPo packs or better yet three 16.0 packs in series. This would make it more simple and cheaper than running four in parallel series for 48 volts.

i am not making the decision just yet but this seems like the best bet as I would not have to solder a controller for 3 kilowatts but simply do a quick install and plug and play for 6 kilowatts and 60 mph. Thanks.

LC. out.

PS. I was told that Johnny is loading a 250 cc motorcycle frame in his truck and should be delivered sometime next month as well as welding equipment.
Not sure what batteries will be needed for the FX motor. SLAs may not work. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Sunder]

If you're willing to invest in this build rather than do it on the cheap, get an Adaptto 2WD Midi-E

It's like traction control for your bike. It pulls back power from either wheel when it detects it slipping

http://adaptto.com/Products/Controllers/

You won't truly be able to boast a 6kw output, since it's unlikely the front wheel will ever be able to put out 3kw without slipping, it will give you more than just a single 3kw rear wheel design.

You will want to make sure you have some pretty solid components for this build, especially torque arms, forks and brakes.

 

[Sunder]

Oooh, and by the way, I have new toys to play with:

https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=87173

 

[latecurtis]

As the Hub Motor Turns and the LiPo Fire Burns. Sudden Death ! SLA battery abuse.

Round trip to the doctor this morning was 3.8 miles. I was charging the old LiPo packs last night and did two and had two more left to do and was not sure if the 16.0 - 6S LiPo pack was charged so I grabbed three SLAs and the volt-meter said 13 + volts for each SLA.

They made it there no problem with the 24" cargo bike but sudden death occurred about five blocks before Stewerts. Approx 2.3 miles total. Of course it just had to be about 50 degrees below zero with the wind chill factor on a day where I had to go somewhere and with no pedal chain so I drained the last bit of energy out of the sad SLAs.

After a hot cup of coffee at Stewarts though they did make it the last two and a half blocks to my house at about 4 mph. :lol: :lol:

The sun is shining and I am on the third LiPo pack and yesterday I tightened up both the chains on the Dual motor 20" cargo bike but it is just too damm cold out to do a video today.
I am probably spending the rest of the day playing pirates Tides of Fortune.

Also the doctor said if I do not get the heart surgery I got maybe two to five years tops so shitty SLA batteries are about the least of my worries now. Thanks.

LC out.

 

[Sunder]

Also the doctor said if I do not get the heart surgery I got maybe two to five years tops so shitty SLA batteries are about the least of my worries now. Thanks.

I know you guys don't have universal health care, but don't you have some sort of low income Medicaid or Medicare support? What's stopping you from getting the heart surgery?

My cholesterol was at 270mg/dL when my Dr put me on the smallest dose of statins. It's now down to 230 - still too high. Ideally, it should be below 200.

I know it's not much comfort, but every time you talk about your heart issues, you encourage me to look after mine. Familial hypercholesterolemia on my mothers side, with two deaths under 60 by heart attack My doctor told me recently I had to double my statins dose, but I get side effects at higher doses, and was resisting doing so... Because of what you just said though, you've convinced me to give it another shot...

 

[latecurtis]

Good. Anything that will keep us all alive longer is a good thing.

My issue is the surgery is at a very high risk. I may have to go to Boston or NY City as there are few surgeons here that will risk it.

The valve leaks or there is feedback into the heart as the tube or whatever which connects to it to pump the blood up thru the body is enlarged / aneurysm.

It is supposed to be 2.5 centimeters and was told today it is 5 centimeters. If it ruptures I will probably not make it as surgery needs to be done within 30 minutes or less or I bleed out inside my chest.

My blood pressure was over 170 also which increases the chance of rupture. It is why I got disability the first time I went before the judge. It was automatic as I am not supposed to lift over 30 pounds and no employer would want to cover me with health insurance.


I do have insurance which everyone on disability has but any new less invasive surgery probably would not be covered. Only older BUTCHER types of methods will be covered which are very high risk. Also it may not cover the best surgeons but maybe someone fresh out of medical school who has only done the procedure a few times. basically only if I am lucky will I have a chance of surviving it. Also I never had surgery and am scared to death. I go to see the heart doctor next week.

It was my new family doctor who discussed this with me after reviewing my medical records. However he is 60 years old with 30 years in the field and has much research and study on my type of condition. Thanks.

LC out.

 

[DrkAngel]

Obama-care is being replaced with Trump-don't-care heath policy, with massive cuts to medicare ... so procedure probably won't be available unless done immediately!
Cheaper to just give you some pills for the next few years.

 

[Sunder]

Obama-care is being replaced with Trump-don't-care heath policy, with massive cuts to medicare ... so procedure probably won't be available unless done immediately!
Cheaper to just give you some pills for the next few years.

As someone who pays more tax than most people earn, I'm personally very split on this issue.

On the one hand, I don't think anyone should be denied health care because of cost.

On the other hand, anything that is free is not valued. Medical tourism costs the UK NHS about 750 MIllion Pounds (About 1 BILLION USD) each year. There was recently a report of elderly people in Australia - who have free ambulance cover - using Ambulances as a de facto taxi service, costing the government around $300 a go - that's two highly trained and paid professionals, in a million dollar van, used to save an old person a $30 taxi fare.

So, nobody should have to pay, but nothing should be free. It's not an easy one, is it?

 

[latecurtis]

I agree on that. Definitely a waste of money to use an ambulance for a taxi. Whats even worse about it is if there is a real medical emergency and the taxi is at a grocery store loading groceries into the taxi awhile someone is dying five or ten miles away could prove to be fatal.

As far as Trump goes I kind of voted for him. Why may everyone ask.

i have basically been anti republican and even joined their little face book hate group : I forget what it is called but it is when John Bohiner the house speaker denied the federal unemployment extension and I was screwed out of about $10.000 back in 2014 as I was fired from my last job in 2013 but fought it and got 6 months of state unemployment. Obama wanted the federal extension as it would save peoples homes but Bohnier and the republican party stopped it.

i was also a big fan of Bill Clinton and thought all that scandal back around 1999 was a riot. I cheered for him when he won his impeachment. Basically the jokes generated from that made billions of people laugh. there is a Clinton av. in Albany for example so hey did you see Monica liwenkski. she is down on Clinton. :lol: :lol:

I started liking Trump back in 2015 when I was at the gym on the treadmill watching him on one of the TVs people watch awhile doing aerobics and he was just starting his campaign. An illegal Mexican stole a car with no license obviously and ran over a US citizen and then backed up over the poor guy making sure that the US citizen died.

And then there is the same old question that keeps ringing in my head since 911. WHY ARE THEY HERE ! The Boston bombing. The list goes on. If I had it my way was I would send every single one back to whatever screwed up country they came from on a slow boat which would sink about half way. One of the women in 911 who died I went to school with.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDGCnB1kYZs

(compliments of Johnny Cash /alias Johnny rebel - The greatest country western singer of all time.)

Don't mind the link. It was on you tube so it cant be against the rules. It is how I feel about any of the countries that any of the terrorists came from (not Africa) as they did not come from there but all those Muslim countries like Pakistan , Afghanistan ect. I don't like ANY OF THEM. Anyone who can guarantee that 100% of them who come thru immigration are not terrorists is a complete idiot as it only takes one of them to blow us to hell. Also Mexicans stealing our jobs and our women and selling drugs to our kids and running over people is totally unacceptable.

That is why I voted for Donald Trump and if it kills me and I had a chance to come back and change it I would still vote for trump. I just hope and pray he gets the job done. Thanks.

LC out

 

[Sunder]

There's a politician here called Pauline Hanson, who is an absolute idiot and no statesman, but she's had two goes at politics.

The first one in the 90s, she was anti-Chinese and Japanese investment in Australia. She was laughed out of politics at the time, but now that the AVERAGE house in Sydney is $1.1 million (about 900k USD- we're talking like 1800-2000sq foot home on a block about 5000 sq foot), and the government has revealed that there are more foreign funded house purchases from China alone, than from first time Australians, people realise she might have had something there.

Right now she's saying that we have no effective way to vet Muslim immigrants, and at worst, they're terrorists, at best, their culture encourages them to stay segregated... And a lot of people are taking her seriously this time.

I think the truth is some where in the middle. I've worked with a lot of very decent Muslim guys. The kind of guys who would give their jacket to a friend if they saw they were cold, and then pretend that they weren't cold themselves. Who worked 16 hour days for the company, and loved their wife and kids. And they'll tell you that the reason they're doing it, is because the Koran tells them they should. Then, I've worked with guys who would watch a terrorist attack in the lunch room, and while they would say "I don't support violence, but... <some rant on how bad America is, and how they deserved it>".

I think we do have a problem. But deporting all of them isn't the solution.

 

[latecurtis]

I think we do have a problem. But deporting all of them isn't the solution.

I can agree on that I guess. I talk to a few of them however I feel that we have enough of them here. Same goes for the Mexicans. We certainlly do not need any more of them coming in.

Country Farms is a small convent store which has been around these parts for years. They are Pakistan. They have little red dots on their heads. However if I am a dollar short they let me go as I am one of their best customers that buy beer. They all have a smile for me when I go their and call me by my first name. the old guy everyone calls pops. I guess they are not terrorists and I would probably let them stay if I was in charge of immigration.

, HOWEVER !

As far as letting any more of them over here it would be the day that a pig grows wings and fly's around. I still do not like them as a whole. I can tolerate the ones who are established and been here a long time as they MIGHT be harmless and can give them the benefit of the doubt I GUESS ! However we still do not know if they could be a sleeper cell but for that matter so could an American citizen living next door who was born here and goes to a Christian church.Look at the Oklahoma city bombing group. Also see Rampage president down.

The bottom line is I fully support Trump on his immigration policy. He stated "They need a good reason to be here"
It cannot be that they come here just because there country sucks ! It is not our job to be rescue rangers or the world police. Thanks.

LC. out.

 

[latecurtis]

I was at Wendy's eating about 3/4 pound of cow a little while ago and thought about the girl I went to school with I mentioned earlier who perished in 911.
it took me a minute or two but I remembered her name. I was not really close to her but the few times we met she would always have a big smile and would joke around like we were together. She liked to flirt. In the 1980s I used to hang around with her brother Mark.

In the 90s I met the girls husband who was kind of slow (mentally challenged) I was at my friend Jeffs house who I grew up with and he was married to the girls cousin. her husband they called Doc.
and when his wife was in NY City at the trade center working it was on those days he would go off his medication and drink. i can only imagine how he felt when she died as it was obvious he worshiped the ground she walked on.

I went to Stewert's to buy my beer tonight instead of Country farms and even opened the door for a white girl and a black man. I have no problem with African Americans. I also feel that the United States should have deployed nuclear weapons on Afghanistan and Pakistan the day after 911 Instead of the long drawn out war to separate the good guys from the bad guys over there that the American people had to pay for.

There is no doubt that it did not work as the countries who harbor these terrorists get the message that we will go there and fight the bad guys for them, then send food , clothes and medicine as well as train their troops. Where is there an incentive for them to get rid of the terrorists there. If we simply NUKED them killing everyone it would have set the right example and today there would be NO place for terrorists to hide. No leader of any country would let terrorists be there as they would know that if the terrorists ever attacked the US it would spell doomsday for their entire race as it should be.

It is not our job to sort out the good guys from the bad guys. That would be Gods job (if he exists) Kill them all and let god sort it out. Thanks.

LC out.

 

[Sunder]

It is not our job to sort out the good guys from the bad guys. That would be Gods job (if he exists) Kill them all and let god sort it out. Thanks.

LC out.

As I understand it, in the war on terror, there were quite a few war crimes and human rights abuses committed by Americans against both civilians, and surrendered combatants.

Should Pakistan have launched their nukes at American soil, because they couldn't be bothered sorting out the dozen or so sick criminals in a uniform, from the 300 million other Americans?