Alan B
100 GW
Too bad it is nontrivial to make a voltage booster at these power levels. You don't need a lot of boost.
BMSBattery/ECityPower Experience
- Thread starter kilowatt
- Start date
Herrsprocket
100 W
Hi Jeremy and All,
The section below is a copy/paste from the Bafang How many RPM? thread, where I mentioned that the data I rec'd was direct from the engineers of Bafang. This was from one of the inhouse data sheets and one of the sales guys sent it along to me. I had/have a terrific relationship with one of the sales guys and he gave me all kinds of answers and details on the BPM motors as well as the new CST motor. It is great to have this kind of honest communication with this person who represents Bafang, I get the straight poop from him on all my questions. He's a good guy, Bafang is lucky to have him. Anyway, this does pretty much confirm certain rpms's at 36 volts for the different codes. It doesn't however explain the lack of understanding that unfortunately BMS Battery has for the coding and speeds of the motors. I was lucky there too, with BMS Battery. I got a guy who went way out of his way to work with me and answer all my questions before shipping and he reassured me (like you Jeremy) that he would double check the order prior to shipping, and he did. Everything was as ordered,,,,,, kind of. The male connector coming out of the motor had gotten smashed during shipping or packing and was completely unusable. The BMS board was also not quite correct. It didn't have any of the wires soldered onto it for the connections to the controller or the battery, ya know, the big juicy ones. Emailed the guy at BMS and he sent me a new male plug with the wires that will wire right up to the inside of the hub (but I will probably just cut and splice the new one onto the old one, don't wanna have to resolder it all up n the inside. Besides, it is the BPM2 and you need a fancy spanner wrench to unscrew the cover off the hub.) And also got some big wires I get to solder onto the BMS board. I can do it. No extra shipping charges or paying for the new parts,,,, cool! But I got lucky, I worked with a guy who was upfront and honest. Now the copy of the post I made in the other thread concerning the code/rpm relationship.
Greetings all,
I'm not sure if BMS battery itself understands its own code ratings and voltages for the BPM motors but simply passes along the information as given to them from managerial marketing. Regardless, many months ago I too wanted to de-confuse the code ratings so I could better understand exactly the performance values and code reasoning for any particular motor. So I began a communication directly with Bafang and they were extremely informative, courteous and helpful. The coding actually from Bafang is quite simple. It seems however, that BMS battery tends to muddy the waters by simply filling in different market needs with a variety of voltages, windings and wheel sizes. This marketing ploy from BMS battery is understandable and does help satisfy a wide spectrum of performance values, but unless you know the basics of how the motors are coded directly from Bafang, you'll be scratching your head like most of us have.
Firstly, the two BPM models and the new CST cassette hub model are all rated at 36 V. The coding applies to a 36 V input and all the values I will be giving you are in unloaded conditions. Let's begin with a code 16 motor and work our way up to the code 8 motor.
The code 16 motor is rated at 192 RPM. The code 15 is 205. The code 14 is 215. The code 13 is 230. The code 12 is 250. The code 11 is 280. The code 10 is 300. The code 9 is 335. And the code 8 is 378. That's right, the code 8 at 36 V is not 393 RPM but is 378. Again, mind you all of these specifications are directly from the engineers of Bafang.
And thus the game begins. The closest proximity I can muster for the difference between a 36 V and a 48 V system is simply to take the code rating at 36 V and multiply it by a factor of 133% for an approximate unloaded speed at 48 V. This is not an exact science but it's fairly close for our unloaded guesstimations. As an example, you will see that BMS battery lists a 48 V BPM model with a 393 RPM output. This is simply a 36 V rated motor with a code 10 winding that is being over volted to 48 V and will now spin at an unloaded speed of approximately 399 RPMs, or as they list, 393 RPMs. The number they list prior to the code value (which is the first number listed on the motor) is a suggested wheel size in which to put this rated voltage and coded motor into to reach a particular miles per hour value. This is confusing. You simply need to know how fast your motor is spinning with its particular voltage and code rating and then figure out how fast in miles per hour it will go with the particular wheel size that you select. Obviously, the higher code windings will give you more torque and less RPM unloaded speeds and might be better suited for larger wheels. However, it's up to you to decide whatever blows your skirt up to get the performance you want.
As TD says," have a nice day".
Tom
The section below is a copy/paste from the Bafang How many RPM? thread, where I mentioned that the data I rec'd was direct from the engineers of Bafang. This was from one of the inhouse data sheets and one of the sales guys sent it along to me. I had/have a terrific relationship with one of the sales guys and he gave me all kinds of answers and details on the BPM motors as well as the new CST motor. It is great to have this kind of honest communication with this person who represents Bafang, I get the straight poop from him on all my questions. He's a good guy, Bafang is lucky to have him. Anyway, this does pretty much confirm certain rpms's at 36 volts for the different codes. It doesn't however explain the lack of understanding that unfortunately BMS Battery has for the coding and speeds of the motors. I was lucky there too, with BMS Battery. I got a guy who went way out of his way to work with me and answer all my questions before shipping and he reassured me (like you Jeremy) that he would double check the order prior to shipping, and he did. Everything was as ordered,,,,,, kind of. The male connector coming out of the motor had gotten smashed during shipping or packing and was completely unusable. The BMS board was also not quite correct. It didn't have any of the wires soldered onto it for the connections to the controller or the battery, ya know, the big juicy ones. Emailed the guy at BMS and he sent me a new male plug with the wires that will wire right up to the inside of the hub (but I will probably just cut and splice the new one onto the old one, don't wanna have to resolder it all up n the inside. Besides, it is the BPM2 and you need a fancy spanner wrench to unscrew the cover off the hub.) And also got some big wires I get to solder onto the BMS board. I can do it. No extra shipping charges or paying for the new parts,,,, cool! But I got lucky, I worked with a guy who was upfront and honest. Now the copy of the post I made in the other thread concerning the code/rpm relationship.
Greetings all,
I'm not sure if BMS battery itself understands its own code ratings and voltages for the BPM motors but simply passes along the information as given to them from managerial marketing. Regardless, many months ago I too wanted to de-confuse the code ratings so I could better understand exactly the performance values and code reasoning for any particular motor. So I began a communication directly with Bafang and they were extremely informative, courteous and helpful. The coding actually from Bafang is quite simple. It seems however, that BMS battery tends to muddy the waters by simply filling in different market needs with a variety of voltages, windings and wheel sizes. This marketing ploy from BMS battery is understandable and does help satisfy a wide spectrum of performance values, but unless you know the basics of how the motors are coded directly from Bafang, you'll be scratching your head like most of us have.
Firstly, the two BPM models and the new CST cassette hub model are all rated at 36 V. The coding applies to a 36 V input and all the values I will be giving you are in unloaded conditions. Let's begin with a code 16 motor and work our way up to the code 8 motor.
The code 16 motor is rated at 192 RPM. The code 15 is 205. The code 14 is 215. The code 13 is 230. The code 12 is 250. The code 11 is 280. The code 10 is 300. The code 9 is 335. And the code 8 is 378. That's right, the code 8 at 36 V is not 393 RPM but is 378. Again, mind you all of these specifications are directly from the engineers of Bafang.
And thus the game begins. The closest proximity I can muster for the difference between a 36 V and a 48 V system is simply to take the code rating at 36 V and multiply it by a factor of 133% for an approximate unloaded speed at 48 V. This is not an exact science but it's fairly close for our unloaded guesstimations. As an example, you will see that BMS battery lists a 48 V BPM model with a 393 RPM output. This is simply a 36 V rated motor with a code 10 winding that is being over volted to 48 V and will now spin at an unloaded speed of approximately 399 RPMs, or as they list, 393 RPMs. The number they list prior to the code value (which is the first number listed on the motor) is a suggested wheel size in which to put this rated voltage and coded motor into to reach a particular miles per hour value. This is confusing. You simply need to know how fast your motor is spinning with its particular voltage and code rating and then figure out how fast in miles per hour it will go with the particular wheel size that you select. Obviously, the higher code windings will give you more torque and less RPM unloaded speeds and might be better suited for larger wheels. However, it's up to you to decide whatever blows your skirt up to get the performance you want.
As TD says," have a nice day".
Tom
cwah
100 MW
Just received my parcel from BMSBattery... They sent me a tracking number 2 days ago.. obviously they are not very quick to keep us up to date with what's happening.
Will see if the charger are working well.
Will see if the charger are working well.
Lessss
1 MW
Why are people blaming BMS for the failure of the shipping company to provide working tracking? I've seen the same thing happen with dhl, fedex and canada post.
sacko said:
I wonder how happy you have been with this controller. I got a 72V version and it wouldn't work at certain voltages while it did at lower and higher alike. Also it would shut off upon extended full throttle use at high speed (10 seconds and more).
From memory, BMSBattery give the tracking number in upper case, which the tracking system doesn't recognise, so you type it in in lower case and it works. It might be the other way round.Lessss said:
I can't understand why people get excited about the high shipping costs. You add the shipping cost to the cost of the items and then decide whether the price is reasonable, which it is!
TheBeastie
1 MW
I have ordered probably the most standard kit and battery from these guys, so far they are now saying its going to be another week before they can ship it. This now makes it a total of 2 weeks since I ordered and paid before they ship my order. Is this normal for these guys?
I was going to pay extra and get a complete kit from emimionsfree but he was honest enough to say he didn't have the battery I wanted in stock, sounded like he was in some kid of transition in battery stock from his reply.
Thanks.
I was going to pay extra and get a complete kit from emimionsfree but he was honest enough to say he didn't have the battery I wanted in stock, sounded like he was in some kid of transition in battery stock from his reply.
Thanks.
winkinatcha
10 kW
Hey TheBeastie,
you ordered a kit from a company of (recently talked about by JH here on ES) bad reputation, that including postage is significantly more than the one I offered you, yet I am local, and offered installation support as well.
'Course ya don't have to, but could you tell me why you did that? Is it something to do with my kits, or the way I sell, or just a lack of trust for local builders/suppliers?
BTW I am still available if you want some assistance with installation.
joe
you ordered a kit from a company of (recently talked about by JH here on ES) bad reputation, that including postage is significantly more than the one I offered you, yet I am local, and offered installation support as well.
'Course ya don't have to, but could you tell me why you did that? Is it something to do with my kits, or the way I sell, or just a lack of trust for local builders/suppliers?
BTW I am still available if you want some assistance with installation.
joe
TheBeastie
1 MW
I think the main reason was that I wanted a geared motor, also you didn't variety of batteries I could choose from. I was hung up on a bunch of little things, geared motor, battery shape I could put in the frame etc, also idea of getting it all in a single order etc. Could argue I was being to square on things but that might change in experience of building an ebike in the future I guess.winkinatcha said:
Also as you may of noticed in that spread sheet I created a while back (and left sitting for a while as I went to New Zealand).
I went a bit nuts from all my options, I partly just came back from NZ and decided to order from BMS because I think I woke up at like 3am after a little thinking and just ordered it in one go online and paid via paypal and locked my self into the decision...
I didnt know BMSbattery were bad at the time, if you remember from my original thread It was kind of recommended to me.
I presume you haven't read the rest of the thread you're replying to.TheBeastie said:
winkinatcha
10 kW
No Stress Mate, and REALLY appreciate your honest reply
thankyou
Joe
thankyou
Joe
Nothing to get worried about. Two to three weeks is normal. I just ordered a couple of kits from Greenbikekit.com. These guys are related to BMSBattery somehow. My theory is that they defected and set up on their own because they have exactly the same stuff. Maybe it's the good guys from BMSBattery because until now Greenbikekit seem to be much more friendly and helpful. They're also even cheaper if that's possible. They have the same Headway batteries as BMSBattery, which are difficult to beat on price and performance.TheBeastie said:
TheBeastie
1 MW
TheBeastie said:
Aahh ok cool, that's what I wanted to here for the most part.d8veh said:
I was getting paranoid they were doing the old "delay everyone's order with lots of excuses and collect as much money/orders as possible while they empty out their offices and disappear with the money trick" (insert Maxwell smart voice), But now I feel better.
I remember there was a local PC hardware site I ordered my video card from, after a while the video card fan stopped working, I went to visit the web site but that page wouldn't load... I googled the site URL and found a forum thread full of people talking about how the PC hardware store site took heaps of orders for new PCs and then got methodically delayed for a good month then just disappeared. I easily just replaced my video card fan so was not big deal but I saw a lot of pain on the forum thread from people who paid sometimes for a very high end PC build and got nothing.
Was getting paranoid that this was going to happen on my ebike kit, I am not use to having to go digging to find excuses, I am more used to and prefer just being told from the beginning to wait a few weeks, even if they had put on the receipt they automatically emailed when I completed the PayPal purchase had said "You've been sucked in if you think you are getting your order in a week", would of been more appreciated. I guess what I got from a unaffiliated forum will do I guess
It is a bit worrying when you place your order and nothing happens. Despite being a bit disorganised, BMSBattery have shown themselves to be honorable people as far as sending stuff. It used to take 6 weeks from order to shipping, but now average is about 2 weeks. All the problems start when you don't get what you expect. They will refund you only if you send the stuff back, which seems reasonable except that you have to pay the shipping cost, which is normally about as much as you paid for the stuff. Luckily, most people are happy with their stuff and don't say anything. It's logical therefore that we mainly hear about things that went wrong, which gives a biased picture. I would be happy to use them again, except that I think Greenbikekit might be better. Only time will tell. So, just be a little patient, your stuff will be shipped soon and it'll arrive quickly after despatch. When they give you the tracking number in upper case, you have to enter it in lower case, or vice versa, to find it in the tracking system.
sacko
10 kW
On the flip side. My second order arrived at my door in 2 weeks and 1 day, couldn't ask for more.
Ordered another 201rpm 36v 500w, a code 12 motor came (bonus) accompanied by a KU123 and various other accessories.
Ordered another 201rpm 36v 500w, a code 12 motor came (bonus) accompanied by a KU123 and various other accessories.
k-harvey
100 W
Just in NZ received another battery from BMS battery china waited 2-3 weeks for my account to change from testing to shipped the 3 days later received the battery for a fellow Kiwi who was in trouble with wrong BMS on battery. A good deal can't see where i'd get better price for this item -0---once again i recomend them but perhaps if too many buy from them they will be even slower.
k-harvey
100 W
thanks for the battery suply web site Greenbike kit seems even cheaper will try them .
k-harvey
100 W
Seems to me everyone should know of the 2 web sites that sell LiFePo4 batteries BMS Battery & Greenkitbike they are very comparable & probably good sites as long as one is carefull to what battery BMS they chose for the motor.
With BMS battery they are a bit slow to get shipped but once on the way even track it themselves they did for me .with these forums they have a lot to lose
if nit satisfying us customers , Thank you endless sphere for helping to make my good battery purchases :
With BMS battery they are a bit slow to get shipped but once on the way even track it themselves they did for me .with these forums they have a lot to lose
if nit satisfying us customers , Thank you endless sphere for helping to make my good battery purchases :
MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER
10 kW
I have ordered some stuff from Greenbikekit.
But still waiting for stuff, also their webiste is down again
But still waiting for stuff, also their webiste is down again
TheBeastie
1 MW
Yeah I noticed that my self, browsing ebikes for no reason is a engrained habbit now.MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER said:I have ordered some stuff from Greenbikekit.
But still waiting for stuff, also their webiste is down again
According to this they are hosted by go daddy which is a pretty big hosting provider.
http://www.ip-adress.com/whois/greenbikekit.com
Maybe Bmsbattery found out about them and have leased a 100k strong bot net to do a massive DDOS attack oh them or something, guess I am suggesting ridiculous speculation, but what else is the net for eh.
MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER
10 kW
Hahaha yeaahh!!!
O well Greenbikekit shipping rates are more acceptable
Also I have ordered from bmsbattery because they are the cheapiest with Magic Pie 3 kit.
But I think there is a link between the two companies?
O well Greenbikekit shipping rates are more acceptable
Also I have ordered from bmsbattery because they are the cheapiest with Magic Pie 3 kit.
But I think there is a link between the two companies?
MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER
10 kW
Update......
Greenbikekit sucks!
They want more money for shipping costs.
Greenbikekit sucks!
They want more money for shipping costs.
e-beach
10 MW
MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER said:
Have you tried to cancel your order with them to see if they will ship at the original shipping price they quoted you?
MAGICPIE3FOCUSPOWER
10 kW
Yes I replied back: cancel my order please.
Also they mentioned to compare the shipping costs with GBK-100R 36V motor 2,1 KG.
The shipping costs would be the same as for my ordered items.
So I did that shipping costs for that motor is about 35USD (Fedex).
They want me pay 30 USD extra so that would be total shipping costs of 60USD for 2,2 KG.
Now doing math: 60-35 = 25 USD.....hmmmmmm....what a shame!
Also they mentioned to compare the shipping costs with GBK-100R 36V motor 2,1 KG.
The shipping costs would be the same as for my ordered items.
So I did that shipping costs for that motor is about 35USD (Fedex).
They want me pay 30 USD extra so that would be total shipping costs of 60USD for 2,2 KG.
Now doing math: 60-35 = 25 USD.....hmmmmmm....what a shame!
Lessss
1 MW
Don't forget tarrifs buty and brokerage when you receive the package, tbut that is your governments dick in your ass there not bms battery.
