Votol EM-100 & EM-150 controllers

Before I get into the details below, since this is not a controller-specific problem, is it ok if I split your posts and my replies off to a separate troubleshooting thread? (best to move them to your build thread if you have one).



1.4v is VERY low, below typical minimums, for a LiFePO4 cell. 2.5v is typically basically empty, and setting above that point, more like 2.8v or higher, is a better idea as it will have less stress on it. 2.1v or so is the lowest I would use if I absolutely had to...but I would use 3v myself to improve pack longevity by reducing stress.

Similarly, 3.4v is really "full" for LFP cells; the capacity between there and 3.6v that they are usually charged to (for balancing) is so small it would be better to leave that and charge lower, for less cell stress and greater longevity. So 90V as overvoltage is high; even at 3.65v/cell (typical balancing / full voltage) for 24 cells, that's only 87.6v.

Less stress means less change of each cell vs other cells over time, and they'll stay balanced better over time, too. (the further they are discharged, the more stressed and unbalanced they will be each time, and the longer a charge cycle will take trying to fix that).


I recommend looking at the specification sheet for the cells you used; this is available from the manufacturer of the cells. (if they don't have these, then you have no certain data about / specifications of the cells and will have to determine all their limits experimentally to be able to properly setup your BMS and controller for them--it also probably means they don't hold their cells to any standard and so every cell could be radically different from every other, so any pack of cells won't be matched in characteristics to each other, and the pack won't perform as well as it would if they were all the same (unless the pack builder tests every cell and discards all cells that don't match each other, which can mean buying many times the amount of cells the pack actually needs).

For a 24s pack, at 2.8v per cell, that gives a pack-level LVC of 67.2v (at the BMS); I recommend something higher at the controller (2.9v/cell 69.6v, or 3v/cell, 72v), but the 67.2v at lowest.

If the controller is set for 67.2v LVC, then set the BMS for a tiny bit lower, like 66.5v or something (whatever the per-cell voltage is for that), so that the BMS won't shut off before the controller has the chance to just release the load. Otherwise you're going to have power cuts on every throttle up when the battery is near empty, because the BMS will cut all power.


If you can provide details about the cells, pack build, BMS, etc., it may help diagnose the problem and suggested settings or repairs to correct it.



If there's no voltage out of the BMS to the controller (actually measured with a meter external to the battery, not just displayed on the BMS program), then the BMS has shut off to protect the cells.

That means that some parameter in the BMS was exceeded (or there is a fault in the BMS itself). If the BMS software doesn't show you what that is, you'd have to measure things yourself during these events, using multimeters or cell monitors, and watch it realtime under load to see what happens. If the event that cuases the shutoff is short enough, you may not see it realtime because of the way meters read and display their data. It might require a reasonably fast multicell logging device to catch, and then see in the logs what happened. This isnt' normally needed; there are other ways to check things.




You'd need to look at any logging info the BMS takes. If it doesn't log the maximum cell voltage difference, or the minimum cell voltages, etc., you'll have to use other methods to find the problem. These smart BMSs generally have some form of logging, even if it is only a simple record on screen of what the highest and lowest cell voltages were, which cell that was, what the highest and lowest currents were, etc.

But first I'd recommend setting the cell limits (votlage, current, etc) to something closer to what such cells are normally designed to handle.

The display you see is probably massively delayed from realtime, and updated very few times per second (or even slower). First the BMS has to read the cells, then process teh data, then encode the data for sending over BT to your phone, then your phone processes that incoming BT stream, sends it to the app it's for, the app has to decode the data stream, process it, and then display it. So it's not unusual to not see voltage sag in some cases like this, especially if the sag is short. (always if the sag is shorter than the display update interval).





Where is the 78v measured, and how?

If it is just displayed on the BMS app, that means the BMS reads that voltage. It doesn't mean it's actually present on it's output.

If it's measured at the controller input, then the controller *is* turned back on (or rather, it has power and could be turned on, if whatever turns it on is engaged).

Also, when disconnected from a load, a BMS's FETs can show a voltage on their output as a "ghost" or "leakage" but when the load is applied, this voltage drops to usually nothing.

If the BMS won't turn it's output back on until it's placed on a charger, it probalby means a cell or cells dropped so low in voltage that the BMS's settings indicate the cells would be damaged if further discharge was allowed without recharging them first.

At some point those cells will probably drop far enough that the BMS will even refuse to charge them, because a cell that goes too low is permanently damaged and can be a fire hazard.
AmberWolf,
Fantastic info, really helped my understanding and trouble shooting. With your help i did find the problem and it wasn’t the controller. we can move this thead.
AmberWolf,
Fantastic info, really helped my understanding and trouble shooting. With your help i did find the problem and it wasn’t the controller. we can move this thead.

I hooked up a volt meter as i rode and was able to see that it did cut off output from the battery even though it still had plenty of power. I assumed that since it still has power it would output it once whatever went low recovered. However, voltage remained 0 on the meter as i was looking at 78v on the BMS app. So i went digging through the BMS app and found a reset button which was awesome and allowed me to bring it back on line.

This process combined with changing the delta shut off limits allowed me to see the following…. (see the attached picture) One of my cells is weak.

Thank you so much for helping me find this!
I am converting an older YZ80 to electric. I bought the whole kit from Siaecosys.com with QS138 motor, Votol EM-150 controller, wiring harness, controls and display. So it is all a kit designed for the EM-150. I assume high brake is designed to be the front hand brake and the low brake is designed to be the foot brake or rear hand brake, am I correct? I do not intend to put switch on the foot brake, I will just use the switch on the front hand brake to activate the tail light. I have not installed the tail or headlight but I have purchased them and I went with 12v for both.

I have attached a photo for reference. All the controls on the bike came with the kit, switches on both sides, display, plus motor and controller. Has anyone bought this whole kit who can tell me where to put the 12v step down so that it feeds all the controls on the wiring harness?

Also, I am not sure where I will find the High Break input in the controller configuration and what input the controller expects.

Thank you!

View attachment 324384
I will put in a picture of the bike for reference

Please help!

I have everything wired up now and all the lights on but the rear break light doesn’t work. it is property connected to the brake wires coming from the Votol em-150 controller. but everything i try with the high and low break wires doesn’t activate the break light.

I have tried to short the low break (assuming it just expects a connection)
ive fed 72v and 12v to the high break line.

None of these things causes the controler to send power to the break light. However, the running light is on which also comes from the same 3 pin break light connection.

What am i doing wrong? I would prefer to activate the break without running power up to my hand break switch if possible.

Thank you!
 
Hello all, I have a em-150 non can bus and I am setting up the dkd display, I have the battery positive and negative wired up and the lin wire correctly connected to the controller, the single wire communication is enabled in the votol software, with key on the dkd display lights up and shows voltage but will not show gears, rpm, or speed, I was told it also indicates throttle input across the top of the display but that doesn't work either, anyone come across this issue and have a fix? I have the same setup following wattster only difference is how I did my wiring harness compared to his, the fitment is on a surron lbx.
 
Oh now I get it.

Tell me if you find the way to do it.
I found the way .... eventually.

I took notes and jotted down thoughts as I was going.

Bit much to dump here, 8000 characters including spaces.

But I'll post them in a new thread when I get time.
(Needs an hour or two to break the info into manageable sized chunks and add necessary explanations.)

I could actually write a user manual for the controller now. No inclination to do that though, unless anyone wants to crowd fund it.

p.s. I watched and enjoyed some of your youtube videos. Particularly the ones on making wine.
 
I found the way .... eventually.

I took notes and jotted down thoughts as I was going.

Bit much to dump here, 8000 characters including spaces.

But I'll post them in a new thread when I get time.
(Needs an hour or two to break the info into manageable sized chunks and add necessary explanations.)

I could actually write a user manual for the controller now. No inclination to do that though, unless anyone wants to crowd fund it.

p.s. I watched and enjoyed some of your youtube videos. Particularly the ones on making wine.

I think people can throw you some coins, if you can make good manual for this controller. That manufacture manual sucks. Just put paypall donate link or something.

Thanks for watching =)
 
This line has a switched full battery voltage. Can i hook the dc dc converter to this line in the controller? The problem is that the DC-DC converter cannot be switched on all the time because the low beam has to be on constantly for there is no off switch as in all motorcycles so i'd like it if the e lock could switch the dc dc through this line so the low beam switches off if i shut the igintion switch. The problems is that there is way more wires in the votol than the wiring diagram shows and this line is not mentioned....
 

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AmberWolf,
Fantastic info, really helped my understanding and trouble shooting. With your help i did find the problem and it wasn’t the controller. we can move this thead.





I have everything wired up now and all the lights on but the rear break light doesn’t work. it is property connected to the brake wires coming from the Votol em-150 controller. but everything i try with the high and low break wires doesn’t activate the break light.

I have tried to short the low break (assuming it just expects a connection)
ive fed 72v and 12v to the high break line.

None of these things causes the controler to send power to the break light. However, the running light is on which also comes from the same 3 pin break light connection.

What am i doing wrong? I would prefer to activate the break without running power up to my hand break switch if possible.

Thank you!
Can anyone tell me what the Votol em-150 needs to activate the rear break light? I have a two post switch on a hand break, what’s the easiest way to get the controller to activate the brake light. The light is all wired up to the 3 pin break light connector.

thank you.
 
Can anyone tell me what the Votol em-150 needs to activate the rear break light? I have a two post switch on a hand break, what’s the easiest way to get the controller to activate the brake light. The light is all wired up to the 3 pin break light connector.

thank you.
The votol neither switches on the light nor the brake light. This is usually done with a 12v voltage converter and the brake lever switches.
 
I think people can throw you some coins, if you can make good manual for this controller. That I think people can throw you some coins, if you can make good manual for this controller. That manufacture manual sucks. Just put paypall donate link or something.

I’d need access to a Votol engineer and the GUI developer to be able to produce anything good.

But I do have something that should prove useful to people.


(Still need some test riding to complete it, which has to wait due to a badly banged up leg from a road bike pile-up on Sunday that’s put me on crutches for at least another week).
 
I’d need access to a Votol engineer and the GUI developer to be able to produce anything good.

But I do have something that should prove useful to people.


(Still need some test riding to complete it, which has to wait due to a badly banged up leg from a road bike pile-up on Sunday that’s put me on crutches for at least another week).
Ok, sounds good. Get well soon :bigthumb:
 
Hi, dear friends. I got my EM-200 / SP2 controller, connected it to the computer, changed the parameters, then clicked "param write" and restarted the program and I see that the parameters are being written all right, but I don't see the rpm in the "display" tab. At the same time, I maintain the speed with the throttle and press "connect" and the program displays the current engine speed for about a second and then the value freezes, there is no real-time update of the values. Maybe someone had this? Please, help.
 
Problem solved! I unchecked the "CAN enable" position on the first page and selected "buadrate" 115200, then "OPEN" and "conect". Now the data packet is transmitted continuously and all parameters are displayed in real time.
 
Hi. I would venture to guess that this is due to incorrect throttle settings. The value of "start voltage" is too close to the value of "low protect" and falls below the latter at some point.
 

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Hello, does anyone have any experience with and recommendations for this issue? My setup is a QS 138 90h with a Votol em-260 and 4 18.5v 5s batteries in series for 72v on a small dirtbike frame. I know it’s a small battery setup, but I don’t think it’s the issue. When I put power to the controller and run the motor it functions normally. After 20-40 seconds, the motor has a huge drop in power to the point that it is unable to spin the wheel unless the wheel is not in contact with the ground. I have played a small amount with soft start, throttle, undervoltage, and HDC settings without any change in outcome. The motor always drops power within 20-40 seconds. I can restart the controller and right away get another 20-40 seconds out of it. The controller software doesn’t show any faults and doesn’t seem to drop voltage. Any ideas? Thanks a lot for any help.
 
trial and error! Unfortunately, I don't know what the programmer wanted to do with it. For me, this power loss, at full power, was uphill. After on/off it went back to normal immediately. The values TC1, tc2, tc3 were all very high. I first halved TC1 and then halved it again. I don't know the exact values now. It worked, I've been driving for almost 1 year since then. Caution! Something may be damaged.......!! I don't know it. Your own risk!
 
hello Guys, So I'm using EM50 votol controller and i'm getting this strange behavior: every time I connect to the controller I get 0 for Undervoltage, busbar current and phase current also it detects EM-30S as model, (FYI it used to work just fine )
 

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hi everyone, i'm new member here..
can somebody help me? i have e bike 800 watt, 60v with 25 ah lifepo4 battery
using votol em50s.
i have activated throttle release regenerative brake, the problem is, after change "rate of decline " value on page 1, the regen feels the same, whether it is 10 or 150. is there another setting should i activate or maybe another problem?
thank you.

UPDATE : Problem solved, by changing the EBS ratio value, usually only rate of decline value is enough.but now seems like i should also change ebs ratio too.
 
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DD hubmotor, geared hubmotor, or middrive?
 
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