New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

[Waynemarlow]

Can anyone recommend a way of getting my standard 42 tooth front sprocket down to say a 36 tooth and still get a reasonable chain line ?

There's the (costly) future-bike.it 30T NW chainring :
https://www.electrifybike.com/store/p66/30T_Narrow%2FWide_Chainring_for_TSDZ2.html#/

Thanks, 30T would be too small, just finding my 42 standard front has been fine through the summer but the winter mud is here and on the climbs even on the 42 rear I have, its just too fast when caught in among other riders. Thinking in that 36 to 38 would be ideal and one can buy a Narrow Wide 104BCD sprocket and the adaptors you can find on EBay but you loose the offset of the standard gear.

 

[NexusG]

Can anyone recommend a way of getting my standard 42 tooth front sprocket down to say a 36 tooth and still get a reasonable chain line ?

There's the (costly) future-bike.it 30T NW chainring :
https://www.electrifybike.com/store/p66/30T_Narrow%2FWide_Chainring_for_TSDZ2.html#/

Thanks, 30T would be too small, just finding my 42 standard front has been fine through the summer but the winter mud is here and on the climbs even on the 42 rear I have, its just too fast when caught in among other riders. Thinking in that 36 to 38 would be ideal and one can buy a Narrow Wide 104BCD sprocket and the adaptors you can find on EBay but you loose the offset of the standard gear.

You said it, a flat chainring will make the chain line even worse
I wasn't able to find any 36T offset chainring for the TSDZ2 so I'm gonna buy the 30T
42T is way too big for my 11-36 rear cog, barely ok for XC use... but totaly inappropriate for enduro/steep hill

 

[phm2000]

Can anyone recommend a way of getting my standard 42 tooth front sprocket down to say a 36 tooth and still get a reasonable chain line ?

There's the (costly) future-bike.it 30T NW chainring :
https://www.electrifybike.com/store/p66/30T_Narrow%2FWide_Chainring_for_TSDZ2.html#/

Thanks, 30T would be too small, just finding my 42 standard front has been fine through the summer but the winter mud is here and on the climbs even on the 42 rear I have, its just too fast when caught in among other riders. Thinking in that 36 to 38 would be ideal and one can buy a Narrow Wide 104BCD sprocket and the adaptors you can find on EBay but you loose the offset of the standard gear.

You said it, a flat chainring will make the chain line even worse
I wasn't able to find any 36T offset chainring for the TSDZ2 so I'm gonna buy the 30T
42T is way too big for my 11-36 rear cog, barely ok for XC use... but totaly inappropriate for enduro/steep hill

Solution is Narrow Wide 104BCD 30T or 32T with a 104BCD adaptor. It's cheeper than 30T of electrifybike.
Offset should be the same (5 mm worse than factory 42T)

 

[Waynemarlow]

Yes the 104BCD adapter ( 18 notes on Ebay ) seems the way to go and it would offer a way of getting say a 42T on the outside for when doing road work if you wanted with the outside few gears.. All my riding is off road so I guess that's irrelevant in some ways. I know from the Bafang I had, you can cheat a bit by taking a couple of gears out of the 10spd cassette and moving them inwards and then resetting the range screw on the derailleur. You end up with 8spds but with a better chain line.

 

[casainho]

About the TSDZ2, as soon we have it flashing the firmware by Bluetooth only, it will be the recommend display for TSDZ2 because will be the quicker and easier way to have our OpenSource firmware running, also keeping the display intact and maintain the water prof. I will then archive the KT-LCD3 documentation pages.

Do you even recommend the SW102 over the 850C display ?
I have read this page : https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/Displays-comparison
The 850C features a clock, large color display and usb charger and the SW102 is bluetooth but I'm not sure which is the most "future proof", in terms of memory capabilities, etc.

That page was written by me and it is updated. Is up to you to decide, but SW102 will soon be the easier and quicker to flash the firmware as also keeping the display intact and maintain the water prof. About memory, both are future proof.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Casainho, we seem to all like the V20, how far out time wise is the SW102 combined with the V20 of the motor software as I need to get my Xmas order in as typically if we get them from China direct, they take about 2 - 4 weeks.

 

[LeftCoastNurd]

SW102 display, flash firmware by Bluetooth only

We have very good news, on next days we will get the SW102 display to work by flashing firmware with Bluetooth only!! SW102 is a modern display and I had seen many ebikes coming to the market equipped with it...

I see these are sold for use with the BB series of motors... As I understand it, those have a different connector/pinout than the TSDZ2 ? so to use one, would require a custom cable ?

 

[RicMcK]

Yes the 104BCD adapter ( 18 notes on Ebay ) seems the way to go and it would offer a way of getting say a 42T on the outside for when doing road work if you wanted with the outside few gears.. All my riding is off road so I guess that's irrelevant in some ways. I know from the Bafang I had, you can cheat a bit by taking a couple of gears out of the 10spd cassette and moving them inwards and then resetting the range screw on the derailleur. You end up with 8spds but with a better chain line.

I made a duel chainring setup 42/53 (for a road bike). I used a stock 42 tooth steel ring and a modified 53. Both are mounted on the inboard side of the spider. I had to space out the spider a little bit with several thin SS washers. This makes for good chain line and no need to modify the front derailleur.

 

[thineight]

Can anyone recommend a way of getting my standard 42 tooth front sprocket down to say a 36 tooth and still get a reasonable chain line ?

There's the (costly) future-bike.it 30T NW chainring :
https://www.electrifybike.com/store/p66/30T_Narrow%2FWide_Chainring_for_TSDZ2.html#/

Thanks, 30T would be too small, just finding my 42 standard front has been fine through the summer but the winter mud is here and on the climbs even on the 42 rear I have, its just too fast when caught in among other riders. Thinking in that 36 to 38 would be ideal and one can buy a Narrow Wide 104BCD sprocket and the adaptors you can find on EBay but you loose the offset of the standard gear.

Hello, on my 29" MTB I have a 11-34 cassette and I've chosen the future bike 30T chainring. With this setup I kept a reasonably high speed on flat (about 35 km/h thanks to the 29" wheels) and also a nice climbing gear.
I had to push the motor slightly on the left due to a clash with the frame going to the rear wheel, therefore I could not fit a double chainring, thing that I did in my other bike.

If you have problems with the chain line you can fit a chain guide instead of the derailleur, it helps to keep up the lowest gear.
If you do Mountain biking I suggest you to have small chain ring, if you do mostly flat you may prefer bigger ones to predilige the Speed.

 

[LeftCoastNurd]

re the tiny chain ring, huh. its stupid easy for my out of shape 65 year old fat body to spin at 60 or so RPM in a 48:11 gear and easily go 20+ MPH on flat land for a number of miles. that bike had 26x1.95" knobby wheels. about the lowest gear I needed climbing 8% grades was 42:17 or 42:19. on my next TSDZ2 build I want to use a 52T with a 13-26 cassette, on a 700x32 hybrid. if I find out I need a lower gear, I'll find a 13-30 cassette...

 

[thineight]

That page was written by me and it is updated. Is up to you to decide, but SW102 will soon be the easier and quicker to flash the firmware as also keeping the display intact and maintain the water prof. About memory, both are future proof.

Good news casainho. I am personally really happy with the lcd3+OSF v.20, but in this case I would consider the SW102 for an upgrade.

Do you recommend a specific hardware version (in terms of chooser, connector)?
Will the v.20 be supported in the newer displays anytime soon?
Thanks

 

[casainho]

That page was written by me and it is updated. Is up to you to decide, but SW102 will soon be the easier and quicker to flash the firmware as also keeping the display intact and maintain the water prof. About memory, both are future proof.

Good news casainho. I am personally really happy with the lcd3+OSF v.20, but in this case I would consider the SW102 for an upgrade.

Do you recommend a specific hardware version (in terms of chooser, connector)?
Will the v.20 be supported in the newer displays anytime soon?
Thanks

I bought my SW102 from Pswpower and I always solder the wires, I do not use connectors.

We will work to get v0.20, I started already to look at it so I can understand it.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Hello, on my 29" MTB I have a 11-34 cassette and I've chosen the future bike 30T chainring. With this setup I kept a reasonably high speed on flat (about 35 km/h thanks to the 29" wheels) and also a nice climbing gear.

If you have problems with the chain line you can fit a chain guide instead of the derailleur, it helps to keep up the lowest gear.
If you do Mountain biking I suggest you to have small chain ring, if you do mostly flat you may prefer bigger ones to predilige the Speed.

Your 30T front 34 rear gives a similar ratio to my 42 Front 42 Rear ( 1.13:1 compared to 1:1 ) but I get the advantage of the spread to the 11 tooth on the road with 0.26:1 compared to your 0.37:1. Top speed is about right for me but its not when you are cycling alone, but when you are cycling amongst other riders in difficult conditions that you need an even lower gear. With the 38T front I'm looking at I'll lose a little top end but then we have a 25kph limit here on the road anyway :wink:

 

[josafrik]

I'm getting this from SVTP tool

> Reading PROGRAM MEMORY area...
Error : Cannot communicate with the device !
Check the SWIM cable connection and check all the needed pin connections on the SWIM connector.

If the application code uses Swim Disable and Reset pin as Output or has disabled SWIM Clock Divider:
Try Now to SWITCH OFF and ON the application Power Supply while NRST Reset pin is forced low.

Error : < PROGRAM MEMORY reading failed.

This is the st-link I'm using:

https://www.ebay.es/itm/ST-Link-V2-Programming-Unit-mini-STM8-STM32-Emulator-Downloader-NEW/112713630569?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Double checked the pinout, it seems correct. I have shortened the cables to the minimum possible as recommended, and I no longer know what else to do.
Any suggestions?

 

[Waynemarlow]

Have you tried reading only the Option Byte first, you need to as the first thing to do when trying to read and program.

Double check the pin connections, I have had a similar message once before when I had one pin on the incorrectly. The small warning light on the STLink went off completely whereas mine turns from blue to red once it programs if everything is in order.

 

[ImpulsePurchase]

I'm getting this from SVTP tool

> Reading PROGRAM MEMORY area...
Error : Cannot communicate with the device !
Check the SWIM cable connection and check all the needed pin connections on the SWIM connector.

If the application code uses Swim Disable and Reset pin as Output or has disabled SWIM Clock Divider:
Try Now to SWITCH OFF and ON the application Power Supply while NRST Reset pin is forced low.

Error : < PROGRAM MEMORY reading failed.

This is the st-link I'm using:

https://www.ebay.es/itm/ST-Link-V2-Programming-Unit-mini-STM8-STM32-Emulator-Downloader-NEW/112713630569?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Double checked the pinout, it seems correct. I have shortened the cables to the minimum possible as recommended, and I no longer know what else to do.
Any suggestions?

Just to check are you programming the motor controller or an lcd screen? I ask because the same device is used to program the LCD3 screen.

Have you tried without an extension cable at all? You should be able to use some TE PCB connectors to plug into the motor controller. This would eliminate any problems with shorts/solder problems in the programming cable.

Finally, it is mentioned that the quality of ST-Link usb units can be variable on the wiki. I bought 3 just in case from different suppliers as they were cheap. The 2 I have tried have both worked well enough so far but it may be the ST-Link usb device? I

Also its worth trying another computer. USB driver issues are pretty common in different hardware setups.

Just a few avenues you might be able to pursue. They might give you a clue as to the root cause?

 

[josafrik]

Have you tried reading only the Option Byte first, you need to as the first thing to do when trying to read and program.

Double check the pin connections, I have had a similar message once before when I had one pin on the incorrectly. The small warning light on the STLink went off completely whereas mine turns from blue to red once it programs if everything is in order.

Thanks, I will do it as you say, reading first with the Option Byte.
I have checked the connections several times and they are correct.

 

[josafrik]

I'm getting this from SVTP tool

> Reading PROGRAM MEMORY area...
Error : Cannot communicate with the device !
Check the SWIM cable connection and check all the needed pin connections on the SWIM connector.

If the application code uses Swim Disable and Reset pin as Output or has disabled SWIM Clock Divider:
Try Now to SWITCH OFF and ON the application Power Supply while NRST Reset pin is forced low.

Error : < PROGRAM MEMORY reading failed.

This is the st-link I'm using:

https://www.ebay.es/itm/ST-Link-V2-Programming-Unit-mini-STM8-STM32-Emulator-Downloader-NEW/112713630569?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Double checked the pinout, it seems correct. I have shortened the cables to the minimum possible as recommended, and I no longer know what else to do.
Any suggestions?

Just to check are you programming the motor controller or an lcd screen? I ask because the same device is used to program the LCD3 screen.

Have you tried without an extension cable at all? You should be able to use some TE PCB connectors to plug into the motor controller. This would eliminate any problems with shorts/solder problems in the programming cable.

Finally, it is mentioned that the quality of ST-Link usb units can be variable on the wiki. I bought 3 just in case from different suppliers as they were cheap. The 2 I have tried have both worked well enough so far but it may be the ST-Link usb device? I

Also its worth trying another computer. USB driver issues are pretty common in different hardware setups.

Just a few avenues you might be able to pursue. They might give you a clue as to the root cause?

I am trying to program the engine by keeping the VLCD5 screen following the Ashrambo tutorial (from Spain), and previously I wanted to save the original firmware in case I had a problem.
Yes, I had thought about it, make the direct connection to the motor connector, I will try to see if it works.
Yes, I had also thought about it, which could be the usb device or the PC, I will ask for a couple of them, in anticipation that the one I have is not in very good condition and I will try with another PC.

Thank you very much for your advices.

I hope to solve it shortly

 

[Narcoleptic]

Hi all!

I have some problems when starting the motor after leaving the bike outdoors now in the winter when cold and wet.

Bike is usually stored indoors nice and cozy and mostly start up at first try in this case.

After parking outside in humid - not even rainy - conditions, maybe just for 15 minutes after a 30 min ride, pressing "i" makes the VLCD-5 display turn on and then off again after a few seconds. This can be repeated ten or more times before it stays on. After starting like this the lights tend to be off for a random number of minutes - up to ten or more - even through display light is on, and speedometer mostly show "0.0" or "E2".

I remove the battery and bring it with me even for short stops because of theft risk, and then protect the connector with a short piece of snugly fitting PVC-hose with a closed end. Have protected most connections i can figure out how to with self-fusing tape but maybe not made a über neat job of it.

Any tips to further protect the system from humidity creeping in (wich seems the only logical cause since this do NOT happen in dry conditions) appreciated. How about the display and the thumb controller themselves for example?

Cheers!

/Narco

 

[ImpulsePurchase]

A bike cover (https://www.decathlon.co.uk/protective-bike-cover-id_2556471.html) will help with rain and snow and to a limited extent with condensation too.

You can get light weight versions that pack into a small bag for transporting too.

However you may need to bring the bike inside to remove any water that has got into the system though.

 

[Retrorockit]

Can anyone recommend a way of getting my standard 42 tooth front sprocket down to say a 36 tooth and still get a reasonable chain line ?

The 42 chainring and a wide range cassette would be the way to get lower speed. It depends on what rear speeds you're running. Older 8-9 speeds require a derailer hanger extension. Newer 11 speeds may have derailers available to run these wide casettes. Sunrace11-40 is the widest 8 speed
I know of. But I think 46-50t low is available in the newer sizes.
My bike is 1x8 so I haven't looked into the newer setups that much. But the Sheldon Brown Gear Calculator will allow you to see where you will end up with this mod.
https://sheldonbrown.com/gear-calc.html
In gear units select speed @ 90rpm for a TSDZ2 and the drop down menu has the available casettes to try out.

 

[Narcoleptic]

@ImpulsePurchase: Thanks but I doubt a cover will be a good solution because a) in rain/snow the bike will already be wet when parked outside after riding it and b) since problem arises at high humidity without rain/snow and a cover will not protect against humid air.

Best possible water proofing of the system as it is being used is what im looking for. Any experiences welcome!

/Narco

 

[Waynemarlow]

Can anyone recommend a way of getting my standard 42 tooth front sprocket down to say a 36 tooth and still get a reasonable chain line ?

The 42 chainring and a wide range cassette would be the way to get lower speed. It depends on what rear speeds you're running. Older 8-9 speeds require a derailer hanger extension. Newer 11 speeds may have derailers available to run these wide casettes. Sunrace11-40 is the widest 8 speed
I know of. But I think 46-50t low is available in the newer sizes.
My bike is 1x8 so I haven't looked into the newer setups that much. But the Sheldon Brown Gear Calculator will allow you to see where you will end up with this mod.
https://sheldonbrown.com/gear-calc.html
In gear units select speed @ 90rpm for a TSDZ2 and the drop down menu has the available casettes to try out.

As soon as you get out onto these really big rear gears, you start to get into the situation of long long rear derailleurs which from experience you wipe off on rutted tracks and the likes. 40T at the back seems to have the derailleurs " hooked " enough to keep them up out the way a bit.

SunRace now does a specific 11 - 42 T rear cassette but as an 8 Spd. I tried it but for some reason the 8spd shifter I had wouldn't change it correctly, with the 10spd I have working fine I gave up relatively easily but wouldn't have minded being able to use the 8spd chains which are more chunky and better suited to the power output.

I'm also happy to lose the top end anyway as my bike is no lightening road bunny with its 2.8 knobbly tyres. As soon as the adapter for the 38T front gear arrives, I'll fit it and report back.

 

[hego]

The torque sensor is death again.Is the second time!!!

The coils lost their antifriction tape.Is destroyed.

May be the bad chain line make a lateral force and bend the sensor.The three little springs can´t controller the gap between the coils.I find the movable sensor coil (and chainring) too deepset/sunken.It moved/shift in time and use.

Anyone with similar experience?

Because is the second time, I buy a new motor.The old motor will be a spare parts.

Cheers

 

[phm2000]

The torque sensor is death again.Is the second time!!!

The coils lost their antifriction tape.Is destroyed.

May be the bad chain line make a lateral force and bend the sensor.The three little springs can´t controller the gap between the coils.I find the movable sensor coil (and chainring) too deepset/sunken.It moved/shift in time and use.

Anyone with similar experience?

Because is the second time, I buy a new motor.The old motor will be a spare parts.

Cheers

How many kilometers did you do before torque sensor destroyed ?
My torque sensor was destroyed after 20 kilometers ! Second one has 50 kilometer, I hope it will continue many years...