Votol EM-100 & EM-150 controllers

[fotoamg]

Your bike is actually made by ZongShen in china, two models available, 26ah with 4kw motor and and 40ah with 5kw motor:
http://m.cineco.cc/#/product_details?id=0&lead_product_id=127

EE6A2E1F-56A8-4EAC-91FB-1B497FAD530D.jpeg
11D960ED-D281-4D35-8157-DAFAACC9E65D.jpeg


In the picture showing the controller programming app, do you have that already? I cant find the controller yet but im looking. Based on the number is 84v100a but used in 72V, so it should be capable of 7200 watts peak which is fine for a 4kw motor.

Once you have the ability to program it, i think you can at least get the designed 70 kph and maybe more. Depending on how much flux weakening it can use effectively.

Hi BareKude!

Thanks, I made a lots of search and found the info I need here is my summary for this morning:

It turned out it is a rebranded motor: Lexmoto Cypher
It has a 1500W controller and 2000W QSmotor, not what M0tr0n seays in spec, it is not 3.7kW and not Bosch motor.

Specifications
OVERVIEW

Model Name
    Lexmoto Cypher

Model Code
    ZS1500D-2

PERFORMANCE

Max Power
    (2.5 hp) 1.85kW

Max Torque
    14.6NM

Max Speed
    28 MPH (45 KMH)

ENGINE

Engine Brand
    QS 1500W

Engine Type
    Electric Motor

Engine Cooling
    Air Cooled

Gear Type
    Twist and Go

Drive Type
    Belt

Start Type
    Electric Start

Battery Voltage
    72

WHEELS

Front Brake
    Hydraulic Disc

Rear Brake
    Hydraulic Disc

Front Tyre
    110/70-12

Rear Tyre
    120/70-12

Tyre Model
    Tubeless

Front Suspension
    Upside Down Forks

Rear Suspension
    Monoshock

DIMENSIONS

Length
    1760 mm

Width
    810 mm

Height
    1000 mm

Wheelbase
    1265 mm

Mass in Running Order
    84 kg

Maximum Laden Mass
    250 kg

Original with the correct specification:
https://www.lexmoto.co.uk/models/ZS1500D-2

Here is a test of the original bike:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSbEGXSSIn4

Motor KIT from QSmotor:
https://www.qsmotor.com/product/mid-drive-motor/

The motor is the 2000W version in it with peak 4600W:
https://www.qsmotor.com/product/2000w-mid-drive-motor/


This method also worked on mine, everything is the same:
https://www.dundeescooters.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/cypher-and-impulse-derestriction-guide.pdf

They changed only some colors and the balance charge port to M25, here this port is used, having CAN H and CAN L signals to be able to start charging or draining.
So not happy, I cannot charge it with my custom low amps slow charge solar panels it needs CAN signals to charge and communicate somehow..
https://www.wellnowus.com/m25-215-male-scooter-socket-e-bike-battery-connector-ip67-30-50a-plug-with-cable-wire-chargingdischarging-batteries-plug-product/

So I could test de-restricted based on Cypher instructions, went until about 50-55kmph in ECO and 69kmph in POWER mode, but I was out of road so it could go above 70kmph a bit.

How to de-restrict the Lexmoto Cypher and Impulse
 Ensure the ignition is off,
 Hold throttle fully open and hold the front brake.
 Whilst holding the above turn the ignition on fully.
 Hold for 5 seconds

 

[BareKuda]

They changed only some colors and the balance charge port to M25, here this port is used, having CAN H and CAN L signals to be able to start charging or draining.
So not happy, I cannot charge it with my custom low amps slow charge solar panels it needs CAN signals to charge and communicate somehow..
https://www.wellnowus.com/m25-215-male-scooter-socket-e-bike-battery-connector-ip67-30-50a-plug-with-cable-wire-chargingdischarging-batteries-plug-product/

Im sure there is a way to connect your solar panels if they can deliver 84v. It would be shocking that a bike so cheap has a BMS that can talk to a DC charger. The charger that it came with would be very expensive is the BMS can tell it what to do.

So I could test de-restricted based on Cypher instructions, went until about 50-55kmph in ECO and 69kmph in POWER mode, but I was out of road so it could go above 70kmph a bit.

How to de-restrict the Lexmoto Cypher and Impulse
 Ensure the ignition is off,
 Hold throttle fully open and hold the front brake.
 Whilst holding the above turn the ignition on fully.
 Hold for 5 seconds

I have a $300 ebike locked ar 25 kph that unlocks to 35 kph using similar method. Mine you hold a brake lever, turn the ignition on, give full throttle 3 times. Then its changed from locked to unlocked of vice versa.

If you can go 70 kph that the design for the weaker Zong Shen Z1. If you are happy with that speed it will probably work well. If not and you can get into the programming you can make it go a little faster or change the controller.

If it has a controller-bms-display that can all talk via CAN, that would be nice. If your display shows true SOC then its talking to the BMS. If the display shows eABS, Motor Fault, Throttle fault, eco/sport etc, then the controller is communicating with it.

If your battery has a s smart BMS you might be able to connect with Bluetooth. I made my own battery so i have Bluetooth access to my bms. I also have a cheap BMS on my. $300 ebike. No idea whats going on there. After having both types, i think i would always try to have Bluetooth access to my battery so i can see how balanced it is without needed to fully charge it.

 

[sam110]

Have you tried to load earlier settings?
The program is a bit buggy, so I think there may have been changes you cant see.

I want to log too, I sometimes get cutouts so I have to stop for it to work again.
(I dont have to turn off the controller, only stand still)
Last time it happened twice in regen braking going downhill, it has only happened when giving throttle before.
My guess is that it is overcurrent, but I dont know. It usually bumps around a lot, loosing and getting traction, that seems to be the hardest for controllers to handle.

Have you fixed yours now? I am facing the same issue now with various setting and now every are put to Zero value except Throttle, Voltage.

I have to wait until the motor stand still before I can start to throttling again.

 

[j bjork]

No, it can happen sometimes. I think it was a long time since it happened now. I have been able to log the event, but the controller doesn't show any error.
My theory now is that it looses sync, or just cut off for safety when the motor rocks back and forth. Like when the wheel hardly moves and you hit a rock I think the chain might pull the motor in reverse.
It seems to happen less as I get faster.

 

[sam110]

No, it can happen sometimes. I think it was a long time since it happened now. I have been able to log the event, but the controller doesn't show any error.
My theory now is that it looses sync, or just cut off for safety when the motor rocks back and forth. Like when the wheel hardly moves and you hit a rock I think the chain might pull the motor in reverse.
It seems to happen less as I get faster.

Oh yeah I found problem too and was also notable the same issue to yours when my bike was flying off the ground. Throttle stop regcon and I have to stop the motor still before start riding it again.

My configuration is:
Votol EM100s, YM3000watts and Jikong BMS

 

[fishblood]

My phone is Samsung Note20 Ultra, so I'm using high resolusion. You can tell me your resolution of your phone, I can send other verion for you.

share my Android APP which link with EM150 by BT, You may change your settings with your phone anytime/anywhere without carring a notebook PC.

and later give me usage feedback/bug-report plz, thanks.


em150.7z

Screen Shot 2022-05-05 at 10.09.39.png
131696.jpg
131695.jpg
131696-1.jpg

Update (em150 protocol Excel)


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hAbPDEfygea4pMolaXExn-4dJR8FMsKq/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=102395760469625306475&rtpof=true&sd=true

I made a excel can generate protocol for em100, and then use the BT terminal tool which I can use barely cell phone and change the settings.
FYI

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ayJZ7FeaZd9Fkl-9bxg7g1MrWPa8x7Lb/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IUYZB8QUwD8PTaGSV2B59CWgMIZdr0IB/view?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1AaeLlZMFbR05QRcymlXSegphxfpRCbEo/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=102395760469625306475&rtpof=true&sd=true

The image does not fit on the screen in width.

 

[fishblood]

Hello,
Update Android APK. Please feel free feedback bugs or any suggestions. Tkx


#for low resolution phone
View attachment em150_demo5.zip

share my Android APP which link with EM150 by BT, You may change your settings with your phone anytime/anywhere without carring a notebook PC.

and later give me usage feedback/bug-report plz, thanks.


em150.7z

Screen Shot 2022-05-05 at 10.09.39.png
131696.jpg
131695.jpg
131696-1.jpg

Update (em150 protocol Excel)


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hAbPDEfygea4pMolaXExn-4dJR8FMsKq/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=102395760469625306475&rtpof=true&sd=true

Tried this option but it didn't help

I made a excel can generate protocol for em100, and then use the BT terminal tool which I can use barely cell phone and change the settings.
FYI

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ayJZ7FeaZd9Fkl-9bxg7g1MrWPa8x7Lb/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IUYZB8QUwD8PTaGSV2B59CWgMIZdr0IB/view?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1AaeLlZMFbR05QRcymlXSegphxfpRCbEo/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=102395760469625306475&rtpof=true&sd=true

View attachment em150_demo4.zip

 

[fishblood]

share my Android APP which link with EM150 by BT, You may change your settings with your phone anytime/anywhere without carring a notebook PC.

and later give me usage feedback/bug-report plz, thanks.


em150.7z

Screen Shot 2022-05-05 at 10.09.39.png
131696.jpg
131695.jpg
131696-1.jpg

Update (em150 protocol Excel)


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hAbPDEfygea4pMolaXExn-4dJR8FMsKq/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=102395760469625306475&rtpof=true&sd=true

I made a excel can generate protocol for em100, and then use the BT terminal tool which I can use barely cell phone and change the settings.
FYI

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ayJZ7FeaZd9Fkl-9bxg7g1MrWPa8x7Lb/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IUYZB8QUwD8PTaGSV2B59CWgMIZdr0IB/view?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1AaeLlZMFbR05QRcymlXSegphxfpRCbEo/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=102395760469625306475&rtpof=true&sd=true

em150_demo4.zip

Hello,
Update Android APK. Please feel free feedback bugs or any suggestions. Tkx
-"Ctl" can control throttle and brake by phone
-"Paddle" set throttle paddle mode with one click
-"EBS' changing-setting change short-cut
-"link" can get setting from controller, "upload" all setting to controller
-"SaveTo" save setting, load setting on phone
-one click can change one setting immediately(controller will be reset)
-"Rst" reset controller manually by phone
-"Lock" lock wheel electrically
-"O1" options 1
-"O2" options 2
-calculating Watt-hour/Km
-use table-referencing calculate BATT capacity

(update Demo7 APK)
View attachment em150_demo7.apk.zip


Update em-100/150 serial protocol, have fun!
View attachment em-100-protocol-fish.zip

 

[templer1]

Samsung galaxy A40 2340 x 1080 (FHD+)
demo 5 & demo 4 the same display!
Old Nexus 2013 fullHD all OK!

 

[fishblood]

Samsung galaxy A40 2340 x 1080 (FHD+)
demo 5 & demo 4 the same display!
Old Nexus 2013 fullHD all OK!
изображение_viber_2022-09-29_00-05-09-811.jpg

Please try this, I cut off some info. I'll spend some time to arrange fit screen APK.
View attachment em150_demo6.apk.zip

 

[templer1]

The default font size in the smartphone settings.

The next from the minimum font size in the smartphone settings.

The minimum font size in the smartphone settings.

 

[fishblood]

The default font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065508.jpg
The next from the minimum font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065648.jpg
The minimum font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065830.jpg

Hi, Thanks for reply.

OK, I understand this issue. I'll detail with it on Holiday.
'cause I prefer use all setting on one screen and Font size is minimized. So I need adjust proper location to fit smaller screen.
BTW, can you connect controller successfully by BT or found some issues ? Please let me know.

 

[fishblood]

The default font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065508.jpg
The next from the minimum font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065648.jpg
The minimum font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065830.jpg

Hi, Thanks for reply.

OK, I understand this issue. I'll detail with it on Holiday.
'cause I prefer use all setting on one screen and Font size is minimized. So I need adjust proper location to fit smaller screen.
BTW, can you connect controller successfully by BT or found some issues ? Please let me know.

Update more compact display APK
View attachment em150_demo8.zip

 

[Paulflieg]

Unfortunately, the "demo8" version doesn't work for me.
Immediately when connecting

 

[templer1]

The default font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065508.jpg
The next from the minimum font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065648.jpg
The minimum font size in the smartphone settings.
Screenshot_20220929-065830.jpg

Hi, Thanks for reply.

OK, I understand this issue. I'll detail with it on Holiday.
'cause I prefer use all setting on one screen and Font size is minimized. So I need adjust proper location to fit smaller screen.
BTW, can you connect controller successfully by BT or found some issues ? Please let me know.

Bluetooth problem demo4-7


My diy Bluetooth adapter hc-06 speed 9600
Version "em150 test" no problem.

 

[fishblood]

Unfortunately, the "demo8" version doesn't work for me.
Immediately when connecting

Please try this
View attachment em150_demo9.zip

 

[templer1]

Demo8-9.

 

[Sattva Ram]

Does anyone have long term experience with votol at 22S? Does the regen work all the way at 22S?

 

[j bjork]

I have run 22s all the time, usually only charged to 90v.
The last few charges I have gone a little higher, 91 or maybe 91,5v or so.
That is for the 2,5 years or so I have run the bike.
You have to be under 90v for the regen to work, it dosent work at the beginning of the first lap.

 

[fishblood]

Demo8-9.
Screenshot_20220930-190400.jpg

Since debug info cannot point out logical failure of APK inventor. And I do clean a andorid phone to factory reset status, then test demo APK. Since not found any error. So maybe there's some different in your phone or controller infect the APK.

SO pls try these debug, you can tell if they work with or without fail-hints. thanks
View attachment em150_debug1.zip
View attachment em150_debug2.zip
View attachment em150_debug3.zip

 

[fishblood]

Unfortunately, the "demo8" version doesn't work for me.
Immediately when connecting

Since debug info cannot point out logical failure of APK inventor. And I do clean a andorid phone to factory reset status, then test demo APK. Since not found any error. So maybe there's some different in your phone or controller infect the APK.

SO pls try these debug, you can tell if they work with or without fail-hints. thanks
View attachment em150_debug1.zip
View attachment em150_debug2.zip
View attachment em150_debug3.zip

 

[sam110]

Solution: I gave up on low brake for regen and connected 12V DC-DC to high brake through the rear brake switch, set regen to 100% and tested, instant lock-up of the wheel no matter what speed i was driving. :wink:
Lowered to 20%, will try it tomorrow to see how high the regen current is.

How was your test and what is the best percentage for the electric brake?
On which page to set this percentage please?

 

[BareKuda]

…what is the best percentage for the electric brake?
[quote/]
It really depends on the vehicle and driver preference. Weak hub motor can use 40-50%. The more powerful the hub motor (and proper controller for that motor) the lower percent you need, 50% could be 80a and lock skid the rear tire.

With middrive its more complicated because if you dont use a backdriveable ratio, even 10% will slow the rear tire too much and you will skid. If you cannot easily rotate the rear tire and spin the motor then chances are the reduction is not sufficiently back driveable. 16:1 single reduction is not back-driveable, but two 4:1 reductions in series (16:1 overall) is backdriveable.

Since EBS ratio setting is the percentage of your current limit you set, its best to have that set first, then set EBS at 10% for hub motor and 5% for middrive and test it when the battery is at about 60-70% SOC (to make sure regen isn’t blocked by battery voltage being within 5v of overvoltage setting) and make sure your battery can absorb the current.

Check it at max speed down to minimum speed and adjust it to suit your preference. My preference is to give enough braking to slow at a comfortable rate, by lightly squeezing the front brake lever. Then if i need more i just feather in some front hydraulic brake. With a gentle tug from the rear wheel the front brake can normally do the rest, even emergency braking.

Beware is you set EBS ratio too high and apply rear brake on top it will easily skid.

On which page to set this percentage please?

Page 3: EBS ratio. This is the percent of the current you set as max current.

 

[larsb]

Might i ask what backdriveable is in your context? i can see self locking worm gears but not really chain drives or even spur gears (where resistance basically depends on the driven gear loading)

 

[BareKuda]

Might i ask what backdriveable is in your context? i can see self locking worm gears but not really chain drives or even spur gears (where resistance basically depends on the driven gear loading)

Back driveable means you can efficiently drive the motor from the wheels. It doesn’t matter what type of gear it is. Worm gears are typically non-backdrop due to their high single state reduction ratio, but you can in fact have a linear drive which is easily back driveable.

With gears you have the same problem. Tesla uses 9.7:1 final drive ratio, and since thats too much for efficient backdriving, its done in two 3.x:1 stages.

Roller chain is probably the most efficient and can backdrive pretty good at higher ratios, but a 10 tooth drive sprocket and 160 tooth rear sprocket is not going to backdrive well.

In your case from 1999, of course now you can look back and see 100% Regen ratio was crazy unless you had a 20a current limit.

But you see many people who lock the rear wheel with regen on these chain driven bikes with high single stage reduction ratios.

5:1 reduction is pretty safe to use regen. 6:1 is getting to the limit.

Torsen limited slip uses worm gear to get the most compact form of single stage high reduction but the same thing can be done with 40:1 spur gears if you have room.

If you know of a single stage 16:1 reduction that has 90% efficiency backdriven if like to check it out.