Adaptto Mini-E/Max-E Owner's Thread

Torque = amps = voltage sag... Perhaps one string in your pack can't handle the amps, and sags too much, causing bms to temporarily cut power?
Just thinking out loud here...



Wheazel said:
Allex said:
Have you tried changing spd smooth values? Also see if you have speed limits in profiles
Click to expand...

Yes have gone over this, and they are not the cause of this. Ontop of that, my profile settings are set as I had them for 4000km with zero problems.
The hesitations are not tied to a specific speed, it happens when enough throttle is applied in relation to the bike speed. Just as if there is some torque treshhold before it starts to act up.
So it is a given that it will hesitate if I pull full throttle from a standstill, even half throttle might be enough. With speed the throttle tolerance goes up.

Worth mentioning is that after the latest (two days ago) controller reflash(back to rc9g3) and full system reset and setup with autodetect etc, the symptoms are harder to expose.
The drivesystem is now abit more tolerant to throttle before it hesitates. I draw the conslusion it has to be some settings that changes and play me a trick here.
Oleg asked me some questions about my battery in the most recent conversation with tech support.
I will wait to see what he comes up with.

Also did skim through all the menus in search for more settings I had missed, but couldnt find anything.
That said, I dont know how some settings affect the controller.
Click to expand...
 
Yes already checked that, and its also a very unlikely cause. Cells are oriented as 18s26p of 18650 cells, and they see only 0,3-0,4C peak discharge. Most of the time around 0,2C.
So alot of cells to handle the 35A limit I ride with most often.

Have also tested disabling the bms, and watching the cellbalancescreen during accelerations.
The cellsgroups don't sag much, or have any meaningful voltagedifference during accelerations either.

However, I think I have found my problem, or part of it at the very least. The culprit is most likely my magura twist grip 5k throttle.
Havent seen anything unusual with it until today. Have done twist calibrations etc with no strange behaviour.

BUT when I did some throttle linear twists today, I noticed that the signal into the controller suddenly flickered when in the upper register.
Looked like it was losing the signal down to 0000 instead of for example 3000.

The strange thing is, why did this occur exactly when I changed firmware?
Did the older firmware have some extra settings for 5k throttles?

I guess I'll jump on the domino train. Or are there cheaper and good alternatives out there?
Thanks for all ideas and feedback so far. Hopefully the ride will be back to normal soon.
 
Wheazel said:
Yes already checked that, and its also a very unlikely cause. Cells are oriented as 18s26p of 18650 cells, and they see only 0,3-0,4C peak discharge. Most of the time around 0,2C.
So alot of cells to handle the 35A limit I ride with most often.

Have also tested disabling the bms, and watching the cellbalancescreen during accelerations.
The cellsgroups don't sag much, or have any meaningful voltagedifference during accelerations either.

However, I think I have found my problem, or part of it at the very least. The culprit is most likely my magura twist grip 5k throttle.
Havent seen anything unusual with it until today. Have done twist calibrations etc with no strange behaviour.

BUT when I did some throttle linear twists today, I noticed that the signal into the controller suddenly flickered when in the upper register.
Looked like it was losing the signal down to 0000 instead of for example 3000.

The strange thing is, why did this occur exactly when I changed firmware?
Did the older firmware have some extra settings for 5k throttles?


I guess I'll jump on the domino train. Or are there cheaper and good alternatives out there?
Thanks for all ideas and feedback so far. Hopefully the ride will be back to normal soon.
Click to expand...


Have you put a 100 ohm resistor from ground to 5V to have a minimal load on the pot throttle?
Hall throttles have a small amp draw, but pot throttles don't, it caused problems before too...

Domino IS a much better throttle then magura, but you'll need the resistor too.
 
wannesd said:
Have you put a 100 ohm resistor from ground to 5V to have a minimal load on the pot throttle?
Hall throttles have a small amp draw, but pot throttles don't, it caused problems before too...

Domino IS a much better throttle then magura, but you'll need the resistor too.
Click to expand...

I will have to check if i did that when I built the bike. Dont think I did, but cant remember good enough to be 100% sure.
I know I did for my tilttrike to get that magura throttle to work with the CA.
So is it preferable to use a hall throttle overall, or is pot+resistor just as reliable?
 
DasDouble said:
Hey guys, does someone know where the cable for the speedsensor is on the display? I want to add sound to my bike which gets "higher" etc, the fast the wheel spins or the more power I give to the throttle.. Any idea? :)
Click to expand...

I dont't know if i get you right, you want do change the volume of some sound accordingt to the speed ? right.
So you wanna simulate a Moped ?
the easiest way would be to install a standard bike computer reed switch with magnet, and the needed electronics afterwards

But if you just search for the speed sensor in :
The speedsensor input at the adaptto display is pin1 of the throttle plug (look into the manual supplement of 2015 on the adaptto support website)
it's the same pin like the brake switch an can only be used either brake or speed - sensor

notger
 
Wheazel said:
wannesd said:
Have you put a 100 ohm resistor from ground to 5V to have a minimal load on the pot throttle?
Hall throttles have a small amp draw, but pot throttles don't, it caused problems before too...

Domino IS a much better throttle then magura, but you'll need the resistor too.
Click to expand...

I will have to check if i did that when I built the bike. Dont think I did, but cant remember good enough to be 100% sure.
I know I did for my tilttrike to get that magura throttle to work with the CA.
So is it preferable to use a hall throttle overall, or is pot+resistor just as reliable?
Click to expand...


Imo the best solution would be a hall-based domino...
Unfortunately we have to choose between shitty hall throttles, shitty pot throttles, and one good pot throttle.
Being a mechanical component, pots tend to wear out after a number of cycles, which is something that doesn't happen with hall throttles.
 
korpin said:
Allex said:
Sett Smph to --- on boost and normal
And why do you have acceleration limits? Sets Acc on "---" for all profiles.
Click to expand...

I cannot get" ---" for Acc or Smph...just a low or high value
Click to expand...
I have the same problem: max 80 km/h with any profile. I have 84v sony cromotor adaptto max e
 
My domino worked perfectly without the resistor, calibration went fine, but Noticed a few things. First, i could not get autodetect to work the motor vibrated during first sequence and my speed jumped from normal 40kmh to 250kph. I thought it was something wrong with the controller so I swapped it out for another one. With it I could not get my magura to work at all, when doing autodetect i kicked back with "interrupted by thr" so I swich back to my first controller where thw throttle worked, but now it was the very same thing, interupted by theottle and on top of that I could not calibrate it. Anyway, the resistor trick solved all of this!
 
Allex said:
My domino worked perfectly without the resistor, calibration went fine, but Noticed a few things. First, i could not get autodetect to work the motor vibrated during first sequence and my speed jumped from normal 40kmh to 250kph. I thought it was something wrong with the controller so I swapped it out for another one. With it I could not get my magura to work at all, when doing autodetect i kicked back with "interrupted by thr" so I swich back to my first controller where thw throttle worked, but now it was the very same thing, interupted by theottle and on top of that I could not calibrate it. Anyway, the resistor trick solved all of this!
Click to expand...

They sure changed something at Adaptto in the firmware or in the hardware because I keep using the Domino with out any resistor and it works with old RC7C firmware with your ex controller.
 
I am thinking of jumping onto a group buy for a v3 mxus turbo motor for off-roading with.
The mxus 3t and 4t are both on Justins simulator. The 4t will make (on level ground with 23" outer diameter tire/17" wheel on level ground) 40mph with 83v ., and the 3t will be 47mph. The 4t slows down considerably on hills(a bit too slow for me)but of course it makes a lot less wasted heat than the 3t.
Heres the choice.... Would i be better off getting the 4t slower wound motor and using OVS to increase speed? I am guessing OVS will effect efficiency but does this mean it will create more heat? Or more heat than the 3t with no ovs?
So what should i do?
3t and no ovs or 4t with ovs?

Again, for off roading only.
 
So i have two max-e contrllers ok.
Set one of my bikes up couldn't get throttle to work.
So i tried two other throttles one cheap hall type and another domino (i have 3 domino throttles btw) none seem to work even with resistor fix.
So i get thinking i have another Adaptto controller sitting in the box so how about i try using a different display on the controller.
Well frock me it works i now have a throttle.
So i email Oleg he says send it back so i do.
He then emails me after receiving and testing the display that cost me 60$ in shipping that nothing is wrong with it and it works perfectly.

It is now on it's way back to me.

Stay tuned
I will be unboxing this thing and fitting it to a controller i know works with a throttle i know works on video.

If it doesn't work i will be smashing the frocking thing with a hammer because I'm not waisting another 60 bucks shipping it back to Russia.
I would rather buy a new display and hope that the new one works. :evil:
 
bigbore said:
Allex said:
My domino worked perfectly without the resistor, calibration went fine, but Noticed a few things. First, i could not get autodetect to work the motor vibrated during first sequence and my speed jumped from normal 40kmh to 250kph. I thought it was something wrong with the controller so I swapped it out for another one. With it I could not get my magura to work at all, when doing autodetect i kicked back with "interrupted by thr" so I swich back to my first controller where thw throttle worked, but now it was the very same thing, interupted by theottle and on top of that I could not calibrate it. Anyway, the resistor trick solved all of this!
Click to expand...

They sure changed something at Adaptto in the firmware or in the hardware because I keep using the Domino with out any resistor and it works with old RC7C firmware with your ex controller.
Click to expand...

Probably the reason why my problems started with a reflash. I dont have a resistor on my cabling.
Will install one and see where it takes me.
 
Allex said:
My domino worked perfectly without the resistor, calibration went fine, but Noticed a few things. First, i could not get autodetect to work the motor vibrated during first sequence and my speed jumped from normal 40kmh to 250kph. I thought it was something wrong with the controller so I swapped it out for another one. With it I could not get my magura to work at all, when doing autodetect i kicked back with "interrupted by thr" so I swich back to my first controller where thw throttle worked, but now it was the very same thing, interupted by theottle and on top of that I could not calibrate it. Anyway, the resistor trick solved all of this!
Click to expand...

I would call this one thing that belongs to the "strange things".
my magura throttle also did not work anymore after FW update (only throttle connected), but after connecting the e-brake (hall sensor type) it function properly again.
this would explain why the resistor helps: it needs at least a minimum curret flow between GND and +5V line, and when using a 5kOhm pot alone the current is to less.
i wonder why Adaptto did this change?
However, like you Allex found out, in my case it didn't had an effect on autodetect.
Autodetect sometimes pass through successful and sometimes not (motor starts to vibrating huge in the third step), no matter what throttle.
Also the autp adjustment of the hall angle in the first step can be sometimes far off (controller adjusts to 20° where it should be around 0°).
since i already had to deal with that on much older FW's, i think this bug was there from the beginning on.


Adaptto, could you please comment on that?
 
ozman said:
So i have two max-e contrllers ok.
Set one of my bikes up couldn't get throttle to work.
So i tried two other throttles one cheap hall type and another domino (i have 3 domino throttles btw) none seem to work even with resistor fix.
So i get thinking i have another Adaptto controller sitting in the box so how about i try using a different display on the controller.
Well frock me it works i now have a throttle.
So i email Oleg he says send it back so i do.
He then emails me after receiving and testing the display that cost me 60$ in shipping that nothing is wrong with it and it works perfectly.

It is now on it's way back to me.

Stay tuned
I will be unboxing this thing and fitting it to a controller i know works with a throttle i know works on video.

If it doesn't work i will be smashing the frocking thing with a hammer because I'm not waisting another 60 bucks shipping it back to Russia.
I would rather buy a new display and hope that the new one works. :evil:
Click to expand...

Have you checked connection of that small 4-pin connector used for thr and brk?
On one display i had an open GND (bad solderjoint inside) and on another i had no connection between a few pins (pins had been too short so no connection).
 
madin88 said:
ozman said:
So i have two max-e contrllers ok.
Set one of my bikes up couldn't get throttle to work.
So i tried two other throttles one cheap hall type and another domino (i have 3 domino throttles btw) none seem to work even with resistor fix.
So i get thinking i have another Adaptto controller sitting in the box so how about i try using a different display on the controller.
Well frock me it works i now have a throttle.
So i email Oleg he says send it back so i do.
He then emails me after receiving and testing the display that cost me 60$ in shipping that nothing is wrong with it and it works perfectly.

It is now on it's way back to me.

Stay tuned
I will be unboxing this thing and fitting it to a controller i know works with a throttle i know works on video.

If it doesn't work i will be smashing the frocking thing with a hammer because I'm not waisting another 60 bucks shipping it back to Russia.
I would rather buy a new display and hope that the new one works. :evil:
Click to expand...

Have you checked connection of that small 4-pin connector used for thr and brk?
On one display i had an open GND (bad solderjoint inside) and on another i had no connection between a few pins (pins had been too short so no connection).
Click to expand...
It should be ok on throttle side because i am using it successfully with the other display.
I went for a ride today i know it works
 
ozman said:
It should be ok on throttle side because i am using it successfully with the other display.
I went for a ride today i know it works
Click to expand...
it still could have been the other part of the connector on the display side.
as i know this connector is not the best, i always measure the connection between solder joints on the display board and the bare wire ends to be sure it is OK.

about the display circuit board: the earilier was V5 and the newer are V6 from what i know
 
ozman said:
It should be ok on throttle side because i am using it successfully with the other display.
Click to expand...

it may still be that the male, throttle side 4pin plug is not matching up well with both displays. also iv seen that some of those plugs are a very subtly different version, and may not be interchangeable
 
Mammalian04 said:
Hi notger. Most people that have tried using with mid-drive motor are not having success and Adaptto officially says they had trouble too and are not pursuing troubleshooting to resolve.
Can you pop over to the Adaptto owners thread and tell us a bit about how you set up the controller with the LightningRods kit?
Click to expand...

So to be honest, since the newest firmware update i just do the autodetect, and the adaptto-with my gng is ready to go.
So i don't think It makes any difference that i use the original GNG small block and not LR's

but sn0wchyld, once sent me his setup-changes and those advices also worked for me, but since the newest firmware, this is not needed anymore.

And concerning the complains about adapttos support, i can just tell the opposit.
Oleg from adaptto, is amazing, it never (really never) took longer than 2 days until i got answers.
And they even helped me out with some wiring plan for my individual mods of the adaptto.
So i can really not echo complains from this thread, and i actually understand that adaptto will not react immediately with solutions if we/you have wishes.
Most people and i guess they are thousands now use the adaptoo up to 14kw with hub motors.
So why should they jump up right at the moment if one of us few dozends LR/GNG users want to use the adaptto too.
Sure it would be nice, but imagine you contact any other professional controller manufacturer about such issues.
Apart from that adaptto is anyway working fine on some peoples LR/GNG - Kits, so you probably refer to old firmware issues wich might be solved in general now.

sn0wchyld said:
firstly make sure OVS is set to 0, as it can throw of initial tuning

run atodetect

if the motor after its initial clunking around to get the hall sequence and phase R doesn't spin up relatively fast/draws more than no load should really be, stop and start the auto again (this happened to me, basically it got itself into a false positive hall/phase combo and was trying to tune itself based on that - lots of heat for motor and controller!)

tune the throttle

once the auto's got some semblance of the right settings, time to start on the manual tuning

for me, i used the eco power setting to keep phase/bat currents low (makes it easy to maintain certain no load speeds) in combo with the speed limit, so set these pretty low, maybe 5A battery and 25A phase, no speed limit, no acc limit
check you've got it right on p23 of http://adaptto.com/MANUALS/Mini-Max-User-Manual-ENG.pdf

go to advanced settings and put ang correction and ind timing to 0
spin the motor up at low to mid speeds (just enough so it spins @ 5-25% of max rpm)
move the ang cor a few points (+-, doesn't matter at this point)
spin up slowly again
repeat till it sounds as quiet as possible at 5-15% max rpm - should mean your ang correction is close to correct.
if your not sure, change it from your current point by a good 5-10deg or more, it should sound progressively worse going up or down from the 'right' point, right to the point where it doesn't spin at all. you've got phase amps set nice and low so it shouldn't cook anything, so play away.

once ang corr is roughly right, rev the motor slowly up to max no load, at some point it'll start getting loud with a low pitch rumble, a sign that the phase angle is less than needed - time to start increasing ind timing
keep spinning it up, increasing ind timing by 50-100 each time until the motor eventually 'runs away' - basically hits a certain rpm and then accelerates suddenly - this is a sign that the phase angle is increasing too quickly, ie ind timing is too high. roll ind timing back to about 80% of this value (so if you get the 'runaway' situation at 200nS, then roll it back to about 160ish)

Now add in some ovs, change it to 1 or 2, and repeat the ind timing. you'll probably find you'll have to roll it back another 10% or so if its anything like my rv100pro. at no point should the motor enter the 'runaway' point.

the motor should be roghly tuned now, as well as i coudl get without hooking up to a oscilloscope anyway (which i still havent done).

pwr timing and stuff arn't direcly related to the tuning of the motor and controller's hall angles, so ill leave it at that. might copy this to my build thread...
Click to expand...
 
Thanks Notger. I think you misunderstood my point. I mention Adapttos response not to bash them but to provide the real legitimate context that even they acknowledge a problem.

That being said, great news that it seems sorted out now! If I come across a good deal on a Mini-E, I'll pick one up and try it with an LR big block.
 
Mammalian04 said:
Thanks Notger. I think you misunderstood my point. I mention Adapttos response not to bash them but to provide the real legitimate context that even they acknowledge a problem.

That being said, great news that it seems sorted out now! If I come across a good deal on a Mini-E, I'll pick one up and try it with an LR big block.
Click to expand...

Hi, i hear that
I often find myself in a kind of devending role, might seem adapttos-asskissing, but i'm just really stunned by this little black boxes, adn teh support. (stop ingratiating here)

But Please LR-GNG-Guys&Girls tell your expereiences with adaptto, if you have some.
And maybe some finetuning tricks if you found some out.

@Mammalian04 whats is actually the problem with LR-MD and adaptto, does it not even spin at outodetect, or run unsmooth, do not deliver full wattage,....???
Cause it might just be a problem of hall-degrees, bad hall sensors, wrong wiring,....

Cause even with my adaptto on old jan2015 firmware, it did work, but did not run even on full throttle.
I also had to change polarity of the KTY84 in my gng Motor, (sometimes it plays a role).
And my Small tiny original GNGN Motor gets tortured with up to 2500 Watts at just 15s, so enormous heat production.
After gettin ghotter than 110°C i sometimes get "hall-errors" at full throttle and 2,5kw, but to be honest i pardon that to a Tortured

I do not know how much we can count on the calculated KV after adapttos autodetect.
Cause the LR/GNG motors should have 67RPM/Volt adaptto calulates 54RPM/Volt ?!?
 
Allex said:
My domino worked perfectly without the resistor, calibration went fine, but Noticed a few things. First, i could not get autodetect to work the motor vibrated during first sequence and my speed jumped from normal 40kmh to 250kph. I thought it was something wrong with the controller so I swapped it out for another one. With it I could not get my magura to work at all, when doing autodetect i kicked back with "interrupted by thr" so I swich back to my first controller where thw throttle worked, but now it was the very same thing, interupted by theottle and on top of that I could not calibrate it. Anyway, the resistor trick solved all of this!
Click to expand...

well, just want to say with all my adaptto experience, from good ol' rc7b right through to rc9e,perhaps 8 controllers, all using domino or magura, have never had an issue on set-up, no resistors required.

dominos are still going strong, but the maguras over time have seemed to develop issues with their output signal of one sort or other(errattic or reduced range)
so have swapped out for dominos. i still have not really studied the maguras(2) that went defective to see what went wrong yet.


brumbrum said:
I am thinking of jumping onto a group buy for a v3 mxus turbo motor for off-roading with.
The mxus 3t and 4t are both on Justins simulator. The 4t will make (on level ground with 23" outer diameter tire/17" wheel on level ground) 40mph with 83v ., and the 3t will be 47mph. The 4t slows down considerably on hills(a bit too slow for me)but of course it makes a lot less wasted heat than the 3t.
Heres the choice.... Would i be better off getting the 4t slower wound motor and using OVS to increase speed? I am guessing OVS will effect efficiency but does this mean it will create more heat? Or more heat than the 3t with no ovs?
So what should i do?
3t and no ovs or 4t with ovs?

Again, for off roading only.
Click to expand...
,

+1 I was also wondering about this with the qs 9kv vs 10kv.
i dont like the drag feeling when coasting down hill, wondering if there would be noticable improvement with a 10 kv?
 
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