New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

[casainho]

Connect the lights directly to the battery and there should be no problem. At the same time, I'm glad that I managed to help with software development and found an bug

This alpha version have an option for configured the amount of current the lights use, to avoid that issue. Well, I guess you now prefer to focus with the travel with your son

 

[sbartle]

Hi Guys,

Have any of you got an 860C without the word "intelligent" written along the bottom of the display? If so, can you tell me where you got it from, please?

Thanks,
Shaun.

 

[RicMcK]

Hi Guys,

Have any of you got an 860C without the word "intelligent" written along the bottom of the display? If so, can you tell me where you got it from, please?

Thanks,
Shaun.

I got one a few weeks ago (bought 6+ weeks ago shipping)
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000524762161.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.27424c4d7ION8W

 

[Keithchris]

So it seems the battery voltage is creating the problem - I have measured the fully charged battery at 54v - I have the same battery from another bike ( same build ) measured at 47v - using the battery with lower voltage both bikes function OK - with the higher voltage battery one bike ( the original problem bike ) will not ‘start’ the other bike kind of hesitated but eventually did ‘start’ exchanging the batteries a few times bike to bike the problem could be switched on and off.
Is there any recommended action I can take now - apart from managing the charging level of the battery ?
The firmware level shown on the display is 4.1 .
Thank you

No problems. You can either:
A) Change over to the Open Source Code firmware for the motor (If you want to keep your standard display, I prefer the qmarco version of the code fork)
B) Change over to the higher voltage standard firmware (found at https://www.eco-ebike.com/blogs/eco-cycles-instructionals/tsdz2-motor-firmware-programming under the "STOCK FIRMWARE ARCHIVE" at the bottom of the page)
C) Change over to the Open Source Code firmware and update your display to match.
D) Return the motor that has the wrong firmware

I think that covers the options?

Would changing the controller in the motor to 48v be an option? -
Thanks again-

 

[ilu]

Would changing the controller in the motor to 48v be an option? -
Thanks again-

Yes, based on the voltage you measured it seems that your battery is nominally 48V, actually meaning 13s ie. 13 cells wired in series (assuming they are the most usual 18560 type cells). Those batteries are commonly charged to 13 x 4.2 = 54.6 volts. A "36V" (or 10s) battery is charged to a maximum of ~42 volts. The charger usually has a label that tells the target voltage. Anyway it seems that the standard firmware for 36V controller allows slightly higher voltage, as battery charged to 47V still works without problem, although the battery state of charge indicator probably isn't very accurate.

I'd say that switching to OSF (open source firmware) for the standard displays would be easier solution and brings additional advantages as well:
https://github.com/stancecoke/TSDZ2-Smart-EBike/wiki
Thread about that version: https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1551727#p1551697

But naturally it's up to you to choose which way you want to proceed, changing the controller is quite a simple task as well, but requires removing the motor from the bike.

 

[Andrew707]

How do you guys find the motor waterproofness? I live in an area with a lot and sometimes very heavy rain and I would still like to continue cycling in such weather. Do you think the rubber seal on the motor cover is enough to not let any water in? Did anyone try to add silicone or something else to waterproof the motor even more? Do you shrink wrap connectors?

EDIT: Another question. TSDZ2 came with a split connector on a speed sensor and if I understand correctly I can connect 6V lights there. What bike lights can you recommend? Aliexpress is mostly carrying higher voltage lights and 6V ones usually don't have very good reviews because they're not that bright and I would prefer to have very bright lights.

 

[skestans]

How do you guys find the motor waterproofness? I live in an area with a lot and sometimes very heavy rain and I would still like to continue cycling in such weather. Do you think the rubber seal on the motor cover is enough to not let any water in? Did anyone try to add silicone or something else to waterproof the motor even more? Do you shrink wrap connectors?

EDIT: Another question. TSDZ2 came with a split connector on a speed sensor and if I understand correctly I can connect 6V lights there. What bike lights can you recommend? Aliexpress is mostly carrying higher voltage lights and 6V ones usually don't have very good reviews because they're not that bright and I would prefer to have very bright lights.

The wiki has some info on improving waterproofing and also heat shedding

 

[ilu]

EDIT: Another question. TSDZ2 came with a split connector on a speed sensor and if I understand correctly I can connect 6V lights there. What bike lights can you recommend? Aliexpress is mostly carrying higher voltage lights and 6V ones usually don't have very good reviews because they're not that bright and I would prefer to have very bright lights.

This kind of light works pretty well, but the 6V output is limited to something like 500mA (read on the forum, not tested) so you won't get more than ~3W output. If you want REALLY bright lights, you need to get the power straight from the battery and either use a switch or a relay powered by the 6V light output. Best to choose a lamp that supports anything between say 6-60 volts, so you can first hook it to the 6V line and see if that's enough, and if not then go the battery route.

 

[cavi]

soo I am basically ready to buy a motor, and I see many vendors, and a couple of them offering motors with the OSF which is what I want. Are any of the vendors main people on this site that I should favor? Who is the most helpful? Feel free to leave a couple of names.
Thanks.

 

[curcumin]

soo I am basically ready to buy a motor, and I see many vendors, and a couple of them offering motors with the OSF which is what I want. Are any of the vendors main people on this site that I should favor? Who is the most helpful? Feel free to leave a couple of names.
Thanks.

For whatever it's worth, I recently ordered a blue gear and new 36v motor on two separate occasions from eco-cycles: www.eco-ebike.com
and each order came within 2 days and the prices seem fair for a U.S seller.

 

[Big_Daddy]

Anyone have experience with both the 36V OSF/850C and 48V OSF/850C? If so, can you comment on differences that you observed. (assist power, speed, climbing, battery life, etc.). Thanks.

 

[casainho]

Anyone have experience with both the 36V OSF/850C and 48V OSF/850C? If so, can you comment on differences that you observed. (assist power, speed, climbing, battery life, etc.). Thanks.

I have no experience with 36V but I read all messages here and I would say the only disadvantage of 36V is that probably 36V motor will heat faster. I can't say why, no one yet we're able to justify this.

With a 36V motor you can have a smaller battery but this is important only for the ones trying to optimize battery weight and size, there are users reporting to use a 24V battery with 36V motor because of that.

Some may say that 36V motor with a 48V battery has the advantage of getting high cadence values over 90 and up to 120ROM but that is not the case anymore with the latest version 1.0.0-alpha.4 of the firmware.

Also, read the TSDZ2 FAQ on the wiki to get some more information that may help you.

 

[Big_Daddy]

Anyone have experience with both the 36V OSF/850C and 48V OSF/850C? If so, can you comment on differences that you observed. (assist power, speed, climbing, battery life, etc.). Thanks.

I have no experience with 36V but I read all messages here and I would say the only disadvantage of 36V is that probably 36V motor will heat faster. I can't say why, no one yet we're able to justify this.

With a 36V motor you can have a smaller battery but this is important only for the ones trying to optimize battery weight and size, there are users reporting to use a 24V battery with 36V motor because of that.

Some may say that 36V motor with a 48V battery has the advantage of getting high cadence values over 90 and up to 120ROM but that is not the case anymore with the latest version 1.0.0-alpha.4 of the firmware.

Also, read the TSDZ2 FAQ on the wiki to get some more information that may help you.

Thanks casainho! This is very helpful and I will consult the wiki.

 

[casainho]

Has anyone ever built a road bike that can share notes and some pictures so I can add to the wiki?

bikesnobyyc user shared very good notes and pictures for his build of an adventure touring bike - see here: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/bikesnobyyc-adventure-touring-bike

 

[knutselmaaster]

I have no experience with 36V but I read all messages here and I would say the only disadvantage of 36V is that probably 36V motor will heat faster. I can't say why, no one yet we're able to justify this.

It seems that the different voltage versions of the motor use the same ampere.
Like 36v = 350w and 48v = 500w, approximately both do 10A.
I haven't seen a 48v 350w motor.
So the temperature values will be the same but the effective power of the 48v version is about 33% higher.
I might be wrong though.

 

[casainho]

I have no experience with 36V but I read all messages here and I would say the only disadvantage of 36V is that probably 36V motor will heat faster. I can't say why, no one yet we're able to justify this.

It seems that the different voltage versions of the motor use the same ampere.
Like 36v = 350w and 48v = 500w, approximately both do 10A.
I haven't seen a 48v 350w motor.
So the temperature values will be the same but the effective power of the 48v version is about 33% higher.
I might be wrong though.

I think, and others did mention before, that must be differences on the wingdings - maybe one has more winding resistance than the other or other magnetic differences on the stator that will make heat faster.

 

[knutselmaaster]

Ah yes indeed I didn't think about that. Often different wire gauge is used for different voltage.
That would be visible though when holding the motors side by side.
I only have 36v versions so I cannot check it.

 

[andrewgateway]

I have no experience with 36V but I read all messages here and I would say the only disadvantage of 36V is that probably 36V motor will heat faster. I can't say why, no one yet we're able to justify this.

It seems that the different voltage versions of the motor use the same ampere.
Like 36v = 350w and 48v = 500w, approximately both do 10A.
I haven't seen a 48v 350w motor.
So the temperature values will be the same but the effective power of the 48v version is about 33% higher.
I might be wrong though.

I have a 48v 250w


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[knutselmaaster]

I have no experience with 36V but I read all messages here and I would say the only disadvantage of 36V is that probably 36V motor will heat faster. I can't say why, no one yet we're able to justify this.

It seems that the different voltage versions of the motor use the same ampere.
Like 36v = 350w and 48v = 500w, approximately both do 10A.
I haven't seen a 48v 350w motor.
So the temperature values will be the same but the effective power of the 48v version is about 33% higher.
I might be wrong though.

I have a 48v 250w


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

Hence, m'y theory has fallen.
Could you please tell me where did you find that?

 

[Elinx]

.....
I have a 48v 250w....

I think this is a 48V " overdrive" version with modified stock FW, so you can use 48V battery on a original 36V 250W motor.

 

[casainho]

TSDZ2 rider max weight

I just added this important piece of information to TSDZ2 FAQ -- see the pictures bellow showing the torque sensor central tubular axle broken!!

https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/FAQ#Rider_max_weight

TSDZ2 rider max weight

TSDZ2 should work well for riders up to 100 kgs. For higher values like 110 kgs, it will also work but it is recommended to avoid doing big impulses (put full rider weight on the pedals) and with high gear, at startup, to avoid the risk of broking the torque sensor.

Casainho wrote: After using TSDZ2 for more than 2 years (since begin of 2018), on different bicycles and with different TSDZ2 motors, doing both MTB and city commuting, with my weight around 105 kgs, I never had a problem.
On 2020, my weight increased to 111 kgs and one day at city I did a big impulse at start pedaling, while I was standing on the pedals with a high gear, the central tubular shaft of the torque sensor broke doing a big cracking noise. Everything went back to normal after I exchanged for a new torque sensor and now I will avoid to do that big impulses on the pedals and with high gear.

 

[Waynemarlow]

Working on the torque sensor I've never really found a way to stop the 3 small springs rattling about as you push the main axle into place, until the last time and then it sort of occurred to me there's a very easy way.

On the sensor unit ( not the axle component ) there are 3 small spring guides to locate the spring. I simple used a long nose pair of pliers and tightened the last loop of the springs making it smaller than the guides. Then you can simply push the springs on the guides and they just sit there in any position attached to the sensor, held by the tension of the now smaller loop.

Worked a treat.

 

[andrewgateway]

I have no experience with 36V but I read all messages here and I would say the only disadvantage of 36V is that probably 36V motor will heat faster. I can't say why, no one yet we're able to justify this.

It seems that the different voltage versions of the motor use the same ampere.
Like 36v = 350w and 48v = 500w, approximately both do 10A.
I haven't seen a 48v 350w motor.
So the temperature values will be the same but the effective power of the 48v version is about 33% higher.
I might be wrong though.

I have a 48v 250w


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

Hence, m'y theory has fallen.
Could you please tell me where did you find that?

https://wooshbikes.co.uk/?cdkit#tsdz2


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[RicMcK]

Working on the torque sensor I've never really found a way to stop the 3 small springs rattling about as you push the main axle into place, until the last time and then it sort of occurred to me there's a very easy way.

On the sensor unit ( not the axle component ) there are 3 small spring guides to locate the spring. I simple used a long nose pair of pliers and tightened the last loop of the springs making it smaller than the guides. Then you can simply push the springs on the guides and they just sit there in any position attached to the sensor, held by the tension of the now smaller loop.

Worked a treat.

I put some grease on them and they stay in place without any problems.

 

[jeff.page.rides]

soo I am basically ready to buy a motor, and I see many vendors, and a couple of them offering motors with the OSF which is what I want. Are any of the vendors main people on this site that I should favor? Who is the most helpful? Feel free to leave a couple of names.
Thanks.

For whatever it's worth, I recently ordered a blue gear and new 36v motor on two separate occasions from eco-cycles: www.eco-ebike.com
and each order came within 2 days and the prices seem fair for a U.S seller.

I buy all my parts from,
https://www.electrifybike.com/store/c38/TSDZ2_Open_Source_Firmware_%28OSF%29_Upgrade_Products.html#/