TSDZ2 mid drive with 860C, 850C or SW102 displays only -- Flexible OpenSource firmware (Casainho code only)

[andrewgateway]

So, I think you need to focus on the values around the knee of the graph, maybe trying to measure 5 values near around, because that zone will have a big impact on the values calculated. Also I think is important for you try to imagine a soft round curve passing on/near all the points and so you can estimate some of that values.

As we can see, your torque sensor is like mine, good sensitivity only from 0 up to 20 kgs.

Ok, thanks. I do changes at weekend.

Hi did you try any new settings, I am also having very little assistance after calibration.

Can you put on the numeric fields the human power and share here your average value as also a min value?

And then, put on numeric fields the motor power and compare motor power VS human power and see if it follows the assist level rate / factor multiplier??

I installed the latest firmware on the motor and display, all is working well.
The up and down buttons work the wrong way round?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[casainho]

I installed the latest firmware on the motor and display all is working well.
The up and down buttons work the wrong way round?

Depends if you install on the left or right side of the handlebar. Read the wiki, the configurations page, to configure for left or right side.

 

[ezrider1199]

https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/Color_LCD/releases/tag/850C_v0.6.4

expand the "assets" and then download these items:
1) 850c- use 0.64_bootloader (e.g. i have a self made cable i use the "_bootloader" with the APT firmware flashing tool)
2) motor- use 0.53.hex file (with stlink and ST Visual Programmer)

 

[ezrider1199]

I tried the latest firmware for about 20 miles and it's amazing. It solved all my inconsistent power delivery issues in the prior firmware so the bike no longer lurches forward erratically. Its sensitive both in torque sensing and in pedal response. Just all around different and more responsive than the 0.19 i was use to.

For assist levels, i modified them to go up by 0.1 e.g. LVL1 = 0.1, LVL2 = 0.2, ... Usually finding 0.2 or 0.3 to be optimal for me

I'm still riding, evaluating and getting use to it but it's been fantastic so far.

Only suggestion is i would like to see some more metrics: average speed, a persistent trip distance (that can be reset like a car's can), and a POWER/DISTANCE measurement (e.g. watts/mile). Also if possible, more responsive UI actions/buttons to match the new responsiveness of the motor

Thanks casainho & everyone!

 

[casainho]

I tried the latest firmware for about 20 miles and it's amazing. It solved all my inconsistent power delivery issues in the prior firmware so the bike no longer lurches forward erratically. Its sensitive both in torque sensing and in pedal response. Just all around different and more responsive than the 0.19 i was use to.

For assist levels, i modified them to go up by 0.1 e.g. LVL1 = 0.1, LVL2 = 0.2, ... Usually finding 0.2 or 0.3 to be optimal for me

I'm still riding, evaluating and getting use to it but it's been fantastic so far.

Only suggestion is i would like to see some more metrics: average speed, a persistent trip distance (that can be reset like a car's can), and a POWER/DISTANCE measurement (e.g. watts/mile). Also if possible, more responsive UI actions/buttons to match the new responsiveness of the motor

This feedback is inline what I feel for current firmware. And because of this, I want now to focus to make SW102 display firmware on pair with 850C firmware, maybe just later I will focus on the other metrics you suggest because I would like to have also them for me, but this is also something other developers can do meanwhile because should not be very hard to develop and make a pull request/ asking for incorporation on the display firmware.

 

[jeff.page.rides]

[/attachment]

Then I shut off the system pulled back on the pedals against the coaster brake to the position that my derailleur is in when it feels best when I’m riding. I measured the pull force at about 50 kilograms and tried it again. Now after pulling back 5kg as the system boots when I ride on the rollers, it didn’t matter which setting I was in, which gear I was in or what cadence I was at even down to 25 rpm or cadence
it was very smooth. I could ride at 2.0 and it had more power than before at 6.0.
If I pull less than this my system doesn’t have enough power for me and if I pull more than this the system wants to run. And I need to stop the rotation, it doesn’t take a lot of effort to stop rotation but if I don’t stop the rotation it will continue to go forward.

Thanks, Jeff

Jeff, it's very easy on the LCD3 to set your levels of power, have a look at the user manual
https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-firmware/TSDZ2_wiki/wiki/0.20.0-%28DEVELOPMENT%29-%7C-KT-LCD3-%7C-TSDZ2-%7C-Manual
and you can set all the parameters to your configuration, the default ones are just a guide and a starting point. As I have said before, set your display to output Motor Watts and then ride it on say the rollers, taking note of what Watts is comfortably best for you. I then set up a level, say No 5 to match that output. The others I scaled up and down to slightly overlap to give a bit of scope for those days you want a bit of a "blast " and some less to give me a workout.

It is not to difficult and you should be able to customize your engine's output to your requirements without having to frig the system by pulling back on the cranks at startup unless there is some software gremlin in there that we are not aware of.

Thanks, but I know how to set it all up. My watts are set at 700w, my amps are set at 16a and I have 4 possible settings in power assist (1)1.0 (2)2.0 (3)4.0 (4)6.0 with eMTB set at 20. If I don't pull back against the coaster brake when I turn on it on I can only use (4) and eMTB and I get tired fast on the trail. On the rollers like I talked about before there's very inconsistent pedaling with hard and easy spots. If I pull back 5kg when I start the system I can use all the settings on the trail depending on how hard the trail is and how hard I want to work and on the rollers, it's very smooth no hard and easy spots.
What I would like is the ability to put in the settings a percentage and when you start up the power assist it thinks that I'm pulling back 5kg or what works best for that ride or rider when were not preloading the torque sensor.
Basically a torque-assist sensitivity setting. By doing this everyone that has a standard motor that can't preload the torque sensor will have the same benefit of adjusting the sensitivity of the torque sensor. By doing that not only do you get the power needed when you don't have the strength, you also as I found out yesterday it's very smooth with no hard and easy spots.
I call that a win-win! Buba knew what to do and was working on the project before he disappeared. casainho is going about it in a different way but may end up with the same result.

So below is a copy of my torque sensor full calibration with version 20 beta 1. I also figured out that when I'm reverse or negative preloading the torque sensor with my coaster brake I'm pulling 5kg and the reading on the screen is 125, 5 less than free pedals, the rest of the readings are exactly the same. So 5kg preload makes a huge difference in the power assist level and function from being difficult and uneven, too much easier and smooth. If there is the way in the firmware to be able to set the torque sensor at a negative from 1 to 5 this would work for all power assist even those that aren't coaster brake and can't reverse or negative preload the torque sensor.

View attachment Torque sensor full calibration MY NHC.pdf
View attachment Torque sensor full calibration MY NHC.xlsx

 

[casainho]

So below is a copy of my torque sensor full calibration with version 20 beta 1.

If there is the way in the firmware to be able to set the torque sensor at a negative from 1 to 5 this would work for all power assist even those that aren't coaster brake and can't reverse or negative preload the torque sensor.

Your torque sensor seems to have the same curves as mine.

If you want to discuss other firmware versions, please go to the other threads.

 

[jeff.page.rides]

So below is a copy of my torque sensor full calibration with version 20 beta 1.

If there is the way in the firmware to be able to set the torque sensor at a negative from 1 to 5 this would work for all power assist even those that aren't coaster brake and can't reverse or negative preload the torque sensor.

Your torque sensor seems to have the same curves as mine.

If you want to discuss other firmware versions, please go to the other threads.

I'm not discussing other software, I just wanted you to know what version I was testing with.
If your newest version can or when it can adjust the sensitivity of the torque sensor. I will order a new 860c display and give it a try.

 

[casainho]

If your newest version can or when it can adjust the sensitivity of the torque sensor.

Here is the feedback from an user of the latest firmware version, about the torque sensor sensitivy:

Its sensitive both in torque sensing and in pedal response. Just all around different and more responsive than the 0.19 i was use to.

I will order a new 860c display and give it a try.

Follow the wiki about how to install the firmware and you will see that only 850C and SW102 displays are supported.

 

[ezrider1199]

If your newest version can or when it can adjust the sensitivity of the torque sensor.

Curious if that's possible as well. Would like to see an option in the configs to modify the sensitivity. That seems like a good setting to personalize. Like every person would have a value he or she feels most comfortable with. Also maybe having assist levels adjustable in .05 intervals?

 

[casainho]

Would like to see an option in the configs to modify the sensitivity. That seems like a good setting to personalize. Like every person would have a value he or she feels most comfortable with. Also maybe having assist levels adjustable in .05 intervals?

Can you please better explain why the need to personalize sensitivity? What is wrong in your case?

Assist levels can be changed in 0.01 intervals, didn´t you saw it on your display??

 

[ezrider1199]

Would like to see an option in the configs to modify the sensitivity. That seems like a good setting to personalize. Like every person would have a value he or she feels most comfortable with. Also maybe having assist levels adjustable in .05 intervals?

Can you please better explain why the need to personalize sensitivity? What is wrong in your case?

Assist levels can be changed in 0.01 intervals, didn´t you saw it on your display??

It's like a gaming mouse or other things where you can adjust sensitivity. It just naturally makes sense to have that option I feel. Just googled that you can adjust torque sensor sensitivity on a Stromer ebike and perhaps others so it's not completely a foreign concept with ebikes.

Regarding levels, sorry it's late in the night here. I must have meant 0.005. Might just be me but there seems to be a big assist difference with a little change in the levels. With .02 I max out cruising at 240 watts and .03 I max out cruising at 380 watt motor power. Would be nice to have an in between option. Also it supports a value up to 2.5 but I'm curious who would use something above 1 consistently or who would ever use something like 2. Maybe the scale of the levels needs fine tuning or there needs to be more abstraction? I hope this makes sense not only from my perspective but as something all could benefit from. Makes sense to wait for more feedback if this is on your consideration list.

 

[casainho]

Would like to see an option in the configs to modify the sensitivity. That seems like a good setting to personalize. Like every person would have a value he or she feels most comfortable with. Also maybe having assist levels adjustable in .05 intervals?

Can you please better explain why the need to personalize sensitivity? What is wrong in your case?

It's like a gaming mouse or other things where you can adjust sensitivity. It just naturally makes sense to have that option I feel. Just googled that you can adjust torque sensor sensitivity on a Stromer ebike and perhaps others so it's not completely a foreign concept with ebikes.

This is the information on the manual of Stromer ebike, please clarify your request!!

Regarding levels, sorry it's late in the night here. I must have meant 0.005. Might just be me but there seems to be a big assist difference with a little change in the levels. With .02 I max out cruising at 240 watts and .03 I max out cruising at 380 watt motor power. Would be nice to have an in between option. Also it supports a value up to 2.5 but I'm curious who would use something above 1 consistently or who would ever use something like 2. Maybe the scale of the levels needs fine tuning or there needs to be more abstraction? I hope this makes sense not only from my perspective but as something all could benefit from. Makes sense to wait for more feedback if this is on your consideration list.

Please give your human power levels and motor current values as also the assist level factor.

Max of 2.55 because riders like jeff.page.rides use their arms and so they may need a very high factor. But yes, there is need for more feedback.

 

[ezrider1199]

Yeah I guess the Stromer reference isn't applicable. I mentioned earlier a person might have his or her own preference but also I think cruising and mountain biking will have different sensitivity needs. Cruising you want consistency and smoothness whereas mtn biking you want most responsiveness. It's still not a big clarification but hope it makes a bit more sense.

 

[casainho]

Cruising you want consistency and smoothness whereas mtn biking you want most responsiveness. It's still not a big clarification but hope it makes a bit more sense.

This is still new for me and I am using my ebike for both things, cruising on the city and also MTB on some weekends. At city, I am also enjoying responsiveness... I think I will wait for this Spring and Summer, that I plan to ride a lot, then I will see.

 

[Zelenaar]

New firmware: Motor max current and Battery max current
....

Sorry, this firmware works only for 850C display as currently there is an issue with SW102 display firmware.
....

Just for info.
Is somebody working on the sw102 display firmware to make it compatible with this new motor firmware ?

Ps : I'm currently already using the sw102 and very pleased with it, and fore sure things will become even better/easier if we can do the configs with the app.
Ps2 : tnx to you (and the others) for those fantastic firmwares (donation on his way )

 

[Localhorst666]

Hi,

I tested 850C_v0.6.2 since last weekend and switched yesterday to 850C_v0.6.4, in each case with related motor firmware certainly. I have a very strange issue. Even after the torque sensor calibration.

Sporadically there is no motor support even on high assistance levels, sometimes directly after system start, sometimes later on. Often when I accelerate and pass 20 km/h, suddenly the motor starts supporting as usual. When I run into speed limit (25 km/h configured, respectively real 27 km/h) the motor turns off (works as designed up to this point), but when I slow down, the motor sometimes don't start again supporting. That happens in maybe in 30% of the cases, when I slow down from >27km/h. I have the feeling, that it's getting worse when I enable the torque sensor calibration. Of course I configured it with my torque sensors measurements (see attachement)!

When I restart the system, it works well for a couple of minutes, but sooner or later the problem happens again. During this issue motor power = 0. At first I thought, maybe there is a defective contact, but all values like speed, human power will be shown as usual. Is it software/user related or could it also be a defective contact!?

Thanks in advance!

 

[casainho]

Just for info.
Is somebody working on the sw102 display firmware to make it compatible with this new motor firmware ?

My focus is right now the SW102.

When I run into speed limit (25 km/h configured, respectively real 27 km/h) the motor turns off (works as designed up to this point), but when I slow down, the motor sometimes don't start again supporting. That happens in maybe in 30% of the cases, when I slow down from >27km/h. I have the feeling, that it's getting worse when I enable the torque sensor calibration. Of course I configured it with my torque sensors measurements (see attachement)!

When I restart the system, it works well for a couple of minutes, but sooner or later the problem happens again. During this issue motor power = 0. At first I thought, maybe there is a defective contact, but all values like speed, human power will be shown as usual. Is it software/user related or could it also be a defective contact!?

My speed limit is set to 50 km/h and I have no such issues. Can you setup to 50 km/h and see if the issue persist?

Also check the hall sensors signals, if they are failing intermittently, then motor will not rotate as it should...

Your torque sensor curve seems equal to mine.

 

[obcd]

Is there a way to keep the SW102 in it's bootloader so that a new firmware can be uploaded over bluetooth, so that it can be flashed without opening it? I know geeksville was working on that, but still had an issue that jumping from firmware back to (original) bootloader didn't work as it didn't enable bluetooth. Also, if a firmware has a bug and freezes, you can't command it to jump back to the bootloader. Maybe there is a trick like holding a button during power on to force it to stay in it's bootloader code, or you can sent some command over the serial port during startup to have it behave like that?

 

[Localhorst666]

My speed limit is set to 50 km/h and I have no such issues. Can you setup to 50 km/h and see if the issue persist?

Also check the hall sensors signals, if they are failing intermittently, then motor will not rotate as it should...

Your torque sensor curve seems equal to mine.

OK. Thanks for the advice! I'll keep you informed.

 

[jeff.page.rides]

If your newest version can or when it can adjust the sensitivity of the torque sensor.

Here is the feedback from an user of the latest firmware version, about the torque sensor sensitivy:

Its sensitive both in torque sensing and in pedal response. Just all around different and more responsive than the 0.19 i was use to.

I will order a new 860c display and give it a try.

Follow the wiki about how to install the firmware and you will see that only 850C and SW102 displays are supported.

Anyone out there no if we can flash the 860C with the 850C firmware and it will work other than the extra button on the pad? From what I've seen the 860C is much better in direct sunlight than the 850C? So I would like is to jump from the LCD3 that's great in direct sunlight to the 860C and just skip the 850C.

 

[casainho]

Anyone out there no if we can flash the 860C with the 850C firmware and it will work other than the extra button on the pad? From what I've seen the 860C is much better in direct sunlight than the 850C?

That will probably not happen as I am being the only one opening the displays and do this initial work.

Also our firmware support the 2 different versions of 850C and the latest version is much better in direct sunlight and also has the same light sensor as 860C. I think 860C has only the advantage of the extra button but costs way more than 850C. Also 860C is almost impossible to open without destroying, so it is way expensive than 850C from the development point, which means that in the end, 850C is way better.

 

[Nfer]

Anyone out there no if we can flash the 860C with the 850C firmware and it will work other than the extra button on the pad? From what I've seen the 860C is much better in direct sunlight than the 850C?

That will probably not happen as I am being the only one opening the displays and do this initial work.

Also our firmware support the 2 different versions of 850C and the latest version is much better in direct sunlight and also has the same light sensor as 860C. I think 860C has only the advantage of the extra button but costs way more than 850C. Also 860C is almost impossible to open without destroying, so it is way expensive than 850C from the development point, which means that in the end, 850C is way better.

One thing I noticed riding last night is that the SW102 display looks more clear without the headlight on. I don't know why but it is curious. It should be the opposite. But it is a great display

 

[Waynemarlow]

I have a SW102 ready and waiting as I thought I would like the smallness and incognitoness of it, but interestingly liking to see a lot of the info you can gather on the LCD3. Anyway has the problem yet been solved of having to open the SW102 for the first time programming or did those working on it get to the stage of solving the bluetooth and boot loader problem.

Have to say Casainho love your work ethic on getting these displays up and running, kudos to you, wish I could program to your level.

Did you ever look at the Emtb mode, an awful lot of the guys I know riding production Emtbs, seem to love it, on the V20 its good but you have to be riding on your own or with only other Ebikers as you can get too carried away and end up 450W everywhere, its fun but tough on battery levels

 

[casainho]

Did you ever look at the Emtb mode, an awful lot of the guys I know riding production Emtbs, seem to love it, on the V20 its good but you have to be riding on your own or with only other Ebikers as you can get too carried away and end up 450W everywhere, its fun but tough on battery levels

Use this thread to discuss only latest version of the firmware. Move to the other threads to discuss the other old or different versions.